Eagle26

Lee is a 3x champ. Everyone thought he would be a 4x state champ in high school too. Don’t count your eggs before they hatch.

Ferrari would be the answer by a mile, but I don’t think you can consider him a “current” wrestler

The problem is that technically the top guy is trying to score by securing riding time. So therefore riding is not stalling. I hate it too, but apparently we need a rule change to address it.

Interesting concept… I’ve thought about a lot of different rule changes, but honestly never thought about this idea. My biggest concern would be that you are adding something subjective that there would be a lot of controversy over. For example, wrestler A is up by 10 and gets thrown to his back with just a few seconds left. How long do you let Wrestler B go for the pin? If you stop it, B’s team will be pissed. If you let it go on for a long time A’s team will be pissed. That’s a no win situation for the ref.

I agree it should be illegal and it already is in HS. I don’t think this is being soft, it is protecting the integrity of the sport. It is essentially a submission because to get the move to work, you have to get your opponent to succumb to the pain first and then you just tip him over. If you have done this move to others or had it done to you, you know what I mean. I’ve seen some nasty power halves too, but I’m not advocating for that to be illegal because you are using leverage to try to turn him and it hurts when you fight it. This is where you can say, if it hurts too bad, just go over. Sometimes a power half is applied when the bottom guy is not in position to be turned and then it is just punishing the guy. That’s usually when the ref calls potentially dangerous. That’s fine, but I don’t like leaving the bow and arrow up for interpretation because the bottom guy is almost never in a position to be turned and it is not the move itself that gets the guy to turn, it is the act of submission that gets him to turn.

Yeah that was weird… couldn’t see the refs signal from the video but there seemed to be no explanation at all?

Wow great job by Latona, he controlled the match

Why did they stop it after Latona’s TD?

Ever heard of Dan Gable? Cael and Gable are definitely in a league of their own, but Smiths coaching record is pretty incredible too. “Only” 5 titles in 30 years, but in the last 30 years, no TEAM other than Iowa or Penn Sate won more titles than that! Plus, factor in he also had 11 other top 3 finishes in that time. That’s pretty darn good.

One of the best interviews I heard in while… every wrestling fan should listen if they haven’t yet. Coach Smith is spot on with things that need to change in the sport. Duals are exciting and we need to find a way to make them matter. It’s not rocket science either… put a bigger emphasis on National Duals and make a qualification system like high school wrestling and other sports so every dual counts. We can achieve this and shorten the season. Each team could have 7-10 duals. Then nationals duals. Maybe one or two tournaments throughout the season and then conference and NCAAs. That would be like 20-30 matches and that is more than enough to keep our fans happy without over doing it. 40+ matches is totally unnecessary IMO.

Yes, high school is already bad for bumping. I do fear it could get worse though. I think the main reason college isn’t as bad is that they simply don’t care as much about winning duals. The main rule change we need to see to prevent this would be to coaches submit their lineup before the dual. Maybe that would allow the new scoring proposal to work?

I know Schalles and others have been advocating for this for decades. I have mixed feelings. I like the emphasis on scoring points, but there could be unintended consequences. The biggest one I think is that we are now rewarding mismatches in skill level even more and the strategy will turn to trying to get your best guys on kids they will tech or pin. So we will see even more bumping and ducking. We need to find a way to incentivize putting your best wrestler on their best wrestler. That will make the duals more exciting… not a bunch of mismatches and easy pins.

Okie is THE most accomplished program in the history of NCAA wrestling! Yes, it’s been awhile since their last national championship, but they have the resources needed to get another one. The job would be a big upgrade for everyone except Brands and Cael. Doesn’t mean everyone else would want to leave their current job, but it would be an upgrade nonetheless.

So you think Penn state is going to fire Cael to hire Taylor? I get your point… I think those guys could get head coaching jobs right from the start, but it is a definite risk for a major program to hire someone without experience. Personally, I think it would be worth the risk and it would be a good hire for OSU to nab one of those guys, but it’s still a risk so I wouldn’t say they have guaranteed jobs wherever they want.

The guy that beat Hahn in Vegas DNP at D1 NCAAs that year. Just because he had better wins during the season doesn’t mean he would’ve come out on top at NCAAs. We’ve seen so many crazy things happen at NCAAs…many of which ruin peoples chances at the hodge. I just don’t think it’s fair to give it to someone who didn’t go to the biggest tournament… that’s my humble opinion. I can understand the case for Wilson… he just wouldn’t have gotten my vote. He did get the votes that counted though so I’m not going to belabor the point

You are right I did post without knowing all the circumstances because I figured it would take some incredible, borderline impossible circumstances to justify it. But I will admit I probably shouldn’t have done that. Anyway, I did some research and I think it supports my claim. Here is WIN’s article for reference https://www.win-magazine.com/win-awards/hodge-trophy/emmett-willson-2004-hodge-trophy-winner/ Wilson had some very impressive wins no doubt, admittedly, much better than I expected. However, we don’t know for sure if he would’ve won D1 nationals. If Scott Moore had not gone to D1 nationals that year, he would’ve won the award. Furthermore, the article also points out 7 different wins over ranked D1 wrestlers. That’s impressive for sure! However, every single one was a regular decision. Then they say the reason he got it over Matt Gentry or Greg Jones (the only undefeated D1 champs) was because he had more pins. That doesn’t seem right to me knowing he didn’t have any bonus on the top D1 guys and then rewarding him for getting more pins. It’s just too tough to compare that to the grind of a D1 schedule when we say one loss eliminates you from the award.

Great accomplishment, but it’s not the “best of the best” for folkstyle wrestling… that would be D1 nationals. I would fully support allowing D2, D3, NAIA, Etc. Back in the D1 tournament. I’m not trying to bash those programs. We need them. I’m just saying in my mind it’s hard to justify giving someone the hodge without them going through a D1 schedule and winning D1 nationals (more on that below).

Pat Pop or Casey Cunningham would be excellent candidates IF they are interested. Another big if would be if JS could keep going until after 2024 and they could potentially bring in one of our big name guys like Burroughs, Dake, or Taylor.

Didn’t really follow back then, but I don’t think anyone who isn’t D1 should be eligible for the award. I know that probably sounds harsh, but this award is about being the best of the best. If you are choosing to not compete against the best, you should be ok with not winning the most prestigious award.

My thoughts exactly… I generally never support splitting a major award like the hodge. However, if they were ever going to do it, it should’ve been Nickal and Nolf’s senior year. Teammates with almost identical stats… that’s the one year I think it should’ve been split.

Looked borderline to me. One of those where looking at it objectively, you can see it either way. But if it’s your team, you would complain either way

Interesting that looking at the individual rankings, there wasn’t a single upset in the individual matches, but the dual overall was a big upset

Good point. I don’t think we need a 6 week break for final X (we used to do it the next day). I don’t want to go back to that but I think we could do a two week break. So we could do WTT Olympic weights mid May, two weeks later Final X Olympic weights, two weeks after that WTT non-Olympic weights, and two after that Final X non-Olympic weights. You would finish in the same six week time period. I’m sure there’s other issues we haven’t thought of but it could probably be done if we wanted to.

I like the idea… where does US open fit in though? I wouldn’t think we need them done that early so I’d be ok pushing things back a bit if we need to

Olympic weights WTT should be a week or more before the other weights. Then allow the losers from Olympic weights to challenge at the other weights. That would give us our best team and we’d get to see some interesting matchups. I like Zahid at 92 but don’t think he’s going to give up on his Olympic dream at 86.