Do illegal aliens use social security numbers of USA citizens?

[jross]

A claim on x.com states that 10K illegal aliens voted in Arizona using the same SSN.  A google search results in articles claiming it was disproven. 

Let's step back and ask if there is a precedence of illegal aliens using SSNs of citizens.  

Antidote - Occurred to someone I know 

• My step-dad had it happen to him in Chicago.  He found out from the IRS when they were auditing him for underpaying taxes on wages from the identity thief. 

Report - 114,023 illegal documents seized by Immigration and Naturalization Service officials in 2001.

• 2002. https://www.gao.gov/assets/a109438.html
  
  U.S. General Accounting Office report number GAO-02-830T -- 'Identity Fraud: Prevalence and Links to Alien Illegal Activities'
  
  According to Immigration and Naturalization Service (INS) officials, the use of fraudulent documents by aliens is extensive. At ports of entry, INS inspectors have intercepted tens of thousands of fraudulent documents in each of the last few years. These documents were presented by aliens attempting to enter the United States to seek employment or obtain other immigration benefits, such as naturalization or permanent residency status. The types of false documents most frequently intercepted by INS inspectors include border crossing cards, alien registration cards, nonimmigrant visas, and passports and citizenship documents (both U.S. and foreign). Also, INS has reported that large-scale counterfeiting has made fraudulent employment eligibility documents (e.g., Social Security cards) widely available.
  
  Reportedly, large-scale counterfeiting has made employment eligibility documents widely available. For example, in May 1998, INS seized more than 24,000 counterfeit Social Security cards in Los Angeles after undercover agents purchased 10,000 counterfeit INS permanent resident cards from a counterfeit document ring.
   

Article - Millions of instances of mismatched W-2 and Social Security Records.  Trillion dollar increase in uncredited wages.

• 2018.  https://www.irli.org/39-million-irli-investigation-reveals-massive-identity-fraud-by-illegal-al/

  IRLI recently filed a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) lawsuit against the Social Security Administration (SSA), seeking records related to its Obama-era decision to halt sending “no-match” letters to employers. The long-held practice of sending the letters had been used to prevent fraud through the use of stolen Social Security number (SSN) data by illegal aliens and other criminals. A “no-match” letter informed employers and employees, usually in response to an employee W-2 wage report, that the name or SSN reported by the employer did not match a name or SSN combination reflected in SSA’s records.

  The FOIA records produced by SSA as a result of IRLI’s lawsuit have shown that, from 2012 to 2016, there were 39 million instances where names and Social Security numbers on W-2 tax forms did not match the corresponding Social Security records. Additionally, over $409 billion was added to the Earnings Suspense File (ESF), which holds uncredited wages that can’t be correctly matched to SSA’s database. From 1937 to 2005, $519 billion was reported to be sitting in the ESF. In tax year 2016, that number rose to over $1.5 trillion.

Article - 11 illegal aliens busted with solen SSNs in Arizona

• 2025.  https://www.justice.gov/usao-az/pr/eleven-illegal-aliens-charged-falsely-claiming-be-united-states-citizens-and-document
  
  Each illegal alien who was charged possessed and used a counterfeit state identification card or driver’s license, as well as a counterfeit Social Security card, to obtain employment at a business in Arizona. The illegal aliens also falsely attested on Form I-9 to being United States citizens or to being otherwise authorized to work in the United States, when in fact none of them were United States citizens or authorized to work in the United States.

Stopping here.  There is much more information out there into the thousands of stolen identities and false documents by illegal aliens.

Yes.  It is known that an unknown large numbers of illegal aliens use fake and stolen documentation.

Edited 6 hours ago by jross

[JimmySpeaks]

Where there’s smoke there’s fire 

[uncle bernard]

Even if it were true - I don't think thousands of illegal aliens voted in AZ, though it's not surprising at all many are using fraudulent documents for employment purposes - I think you'd be surprised to see how many of them would vote conservative. Illegal immigrants from Latin America are incredibly socially conservative.

The Latino vote in general continues to shift conservative for this reason. Many are economically populist - which is why politicians like Bernie do very well with them - but establishment dems like Harris who offer very little economic policy and mostly signal on liberal cultural issues do not do well with them.

[uncle bernard]

2 minutes ago, JimmySpeaks said:

Where there’s smoke there’s fire 

The Trump administration has been investigating this for years now. I'm sure they will publish a comprehensive report documenting the fraud if they find credible evidence.

[JimmySpeaks]

50 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

The Trump administration has been investigating this for years now. I'm sure they will publish a comprehensive report documenting the fraud if they find credible evidence.

Why wouldn’t they ? Fraud is fraud 

[fishbane]

52 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

Even if it were true - I don't think thousands of illegal aliens voted in AZ, though it's not surprising at all many are using fraudulent documents for employment purposes - I think you'd be surprised to see how many of them would vote conservative. Illegal immigrants from Latin America are incredibly socially conservative.

The Latino vote in general continues to shift conservative for this reason. Many are economically populist - which is why politicians like Bernie do very well with them - but establishment dems like Harris who offer very little economic policy and mostly signal on liberal cultural issues do not do well with them.

I don’t know about the voting persuasions you cited, but I tend to agree with your point on using fraudulent documents for employment vs voting.  There would be an obvious practical incentive to use fraud for employment purposes.  The person could get a job they wouldn’t normally be allowed to have - there would be a necessity to it.  Voting on the other hand seems like all risk with very little reward for the individual.  It’s also entirely optional compared with earning money to pay one’s bills.

The SSN claim also sounds a little odd.  SSN is not something that gets directly used in voting unlike paying wages and taxes.  In fact SSN is not a required field on the AZ voter registration form.  The SSN field is optional and only asks for the last 4 digits. You must provide proof of citizenship but that could be a birth certificate which would not have a SSN on it either and I don’t know if that was required in 2020 which I think is the election applicable to the claim.  

If someone were trying to illegally vote why provide a SSN at all?  That simply makes it more likely to get caught, no?  I wonder what SSN were these votes allegedly cast under?  000-00-000? How did they determine it to be illegal aliens that voted?

https://azsos.gov/sites/default/files/docs/az_voter_registration_form_standard_20240613.pdf

[uncle bernard]

25 minutes ago, JimmySpeaks said:

Why wouldn’t they ? Fraud is fraud 

Exactly. I look forward to the report and will judge based on the evidence they provide, just like the Antifa thing. 

You're more plugged into conservative media than I am. Is there an expected timeline for these publishings? 

[uncle bernard]

4 minutes ago, fishbane said:

I don’t know about the voting persuasions you cited, but I tend to agree with your point on using fraudulent documents for employment vs voting.  There would be an obvious practical incentive to use fraud for employment purposes.  The person could get a job they wouldn’t normally be allowed to have - there would be a necessity to it.  Voting on the other hand seems like all risk with very little reward for the individual.  It’s also entirely optional compared with earning money to pay one’s bills.

The SSN claim also sounds a little odd.  SSN is not something that gets directly used in voting unlike paying wages and taxes.  In fact SSN is not a required field on the AZ voter registration form.  The SSN field is optional and only asks for the last 4 digits. You must provide proof of citizenship but that could be a birth certificate which would not have a SSN on it either and I don’t know if that was required in 2020 which I think is the election applicable to the claim.  

If someone were trying to illegally vote why provide a SSN at all?  That simply makes it more likely to get caught, no?  I wonder what SSN were these votes allegedly cast under?  000-00-000? How did they determine it to be illegal aliens that voted?

https://azsos.gov/sites/default/files/docs/az_voter_registration_form_standard_20240613.pdf

Very well put. A lot of these theories fall apart once you hold them up against the real world context - like the voting process in AZ. 

[reversaloffortune]

1 hour ago, jross said:

A claim on x.com states that 10K illegal aliens voted in Arizona using the same SSN.  A google search results in articles claiming it was disproven. 

There is your answer.  No reason to explore further as far as voting is concerned.

[jross]

Do illegal aliens use social security numbers of USA citizens?  Social Security Chief Actuary says "Yes."   

75% of illegal aliens are committing the underreported crime by using fraudulent papers.

Quote

Our assumption is that about three-quarters of other-than-legal immigrants pay payroll taxes," said Stephen C. Goss, Social Security's chief actuary - https://web.archive.org/web/20240114140649/https://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/05/business/illegal-immigrants-are-bolstering-social-security-with-billions.html

 

[Tripnsweep]

Using somebody's SSN to put something down on an application to work really doesn't do much. Most employers don't really do eVerify anyway, or they just say they do. I know probably a dozen people who've been in this country out of status for years who work. As long as we have employers who overlook these things, it's going to happen. 

It really isn't a big deal because they end up paying into a system they can't reap any benefits from later on. 

[jross]

10 minutes ago, Tripnsweep said:

Using somebody's SSN to put something down on an application to work really doesn't do much...

It really isn't a big deal because they end up paying into a system they can't reap any benefits from later on. 

Except my step dad that was being audited as result of underpaid taxes?  It was a big deal to him.  Normalizing crime and dismissing victims is not the best look... 

• Identity Theft (18 U.S.C. § 1028) is a felony with up to 15 years in prison.
• Social Security Number Misuse (42 U.S.C. § 408) is a felony with up to 5 years in prison.
• Immigration-Related Fraud (18 U.S.C. § 1546) is a felony with from 10 to even 25 years in prison.

 

[mspart]

3 hours ago, uncle bernard said:

The Trump administration has been investigating this for years now. I'm sure they will publish a comprehensive report documenting the fraud if they find credible evidence.

The Trump admin has not been in office for years now.   

mspart

[uncle bernard]

31 minutes ago, mspart said:

The Trump admin has not been in office for years now.   

mspart

They were also investigating this during his first term. Then they spent much of his term out of office litigating lawsuits over this issue, which also involved extensive research. They've been looking for the smoking gun for nearly a decade. I'm sure they'll publish it soon!

[JimmySpeaks]

3 hours ago, uncle bernard said:

Exactly. I look forward to the report and will judge based on the evidence they provide, just like the Antifa thing. 

You're more plugged into conservative media than I am. Is there an expected timeline for these publishings? 

I’m plugged into conservative media.  Really?  Good to know. 

[mspart]

1 hour ago, uncle bernard said:

They were also investigating this during his first term. Then they spent much of his term out of office litigating lawsuits over this issue, which also involved extensive research. They've been looking for the smoking gun for nearly a decade. I'm sure they'll publish it soon!

I don't know about his first term.   I don't remember him going after illegals like he is now.  

I don't remember any litigation against illegals while he was out of office.   Sounds fishy to me to be litigating this when he is out of power.   Please provide some solid evidence of this. 

I do believe they are looking into it now, but that is months, not years.   Unless you can show otherwise. 

mspart

[Tripnsweep]

2 hours ago, jross said:

Except my step dad that was being audited as result of underpaid taxes?  It was a big deal to him.  Normalizing crime and dismissing victims is not the best look... 

• Identity Theft (18 U.S.C. § 1028) is a felony with up to 15 years in prison.
• Social Security Number Misuse (42 U.S.C. § 408) is a felony with up to 5 years in prison.
• Immigration-Related Fraud (18 U.S.C. § 1546) is a felony with from 10 to even 25 years in prison.

 

Using somebody's ID to get into a bar is identity theft. You going to start rounding up college students trying to get into bars? 

[jross]

1 hour ago, Tripnsweep said:

Using somebody's ID to get into a bar is identity theft. You going to start rounding up college students trying to get into bars? 

There might be impacts to explore...

What can happen to the bar owner/staff if they are found to serve alcohol to a minor?  What happens to victims and their families when an under age kid commits a crime due to impaired decision making?  What happens to car insurance and health insurance rates?  What happens to the lines to check ID if this is a popular bar?  What happens to the bar's attendance if it becomes known for letting underaged kids in?  If its a stolen ID rather than fake ID, what can happen to the real ID owner? 

Edited 21 minutes ago by jross