Men's Freestyle Seeds for the 2025 Senior World Championships... ARE OUT!

[D3 for LU]

Even though, the seedings are a result from various wrestlers attending, placing,(AND winning) various ranking tournaments...

it IS surprising to see that only FOUR (Lee #1 @ 57Kg, Valencia #4 @ 86Kg, Trent Hidlay #8 @ 92Kg, & Synder #3 @ 97Kg) are seeded.

 

Much like the U20, the Senior World Championships will start off w/ the FS tournament 1st, on Saturday, September 13.

(61, 70, 86, and 125 kg)

 

For some... pairing off w/an unseeded American may be a dangerous draw.

(Wyatt HENDRICKSON anyone? )

D3

Edited yesterday at 02:35 PM by D3 for LU

[El Luchador]

That line up for America definitely is showing a changing of the guard. 

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

Hartunyan 57 Kg.

Cruz vs RBY early?

Without seeing the random draw, how is Trent looking as the #8?

[bnwtwg]

It's not surprising whatsoever. Primary points are based off previous year's championship results at the weight currently being contested (eg. Dake would have 0 seeding points at 86) and supplemental points from rankings series (4 total tournies this year not heavily attended by any single athlete) + continental tourneys (1 per region [Pan-Am, Euros, Asian, Oceania, African]).

Out of the Team USA roster only 12 total tourneys were wrestled and none more than twice. Given the turnover of the team and the fact that a couple guys were wrapping up their junior year studying for the SAT, the numbers don't lie.

 

		Zagreb	Tiran	Mongolia	Pan-Ams	Budapest	Total
		(Feb)	(Feb)	(May)	(May)	(July)
57	Spencer	1st	---	---	---	---	1
61	Forrest	---	---	---	1st	---	1
65	Woods	---	3rd	---	---	---	1
70	Duke	---	---	---	---	---	0
74	Carr	2nd	---	---	---	3rd	2
79	Haines	---	---	---	---	---	0
86	Zahid	1st	---	---	1st	---	2
92	Hidlay	---	---	---	1st	1st	2
97	Snyder	1st	3rd	---	---	---	2
125	Pindrickson	---	---	---	1st	---	1

 

Edited 17 hours ago by bnwtwg
this is just a footnote in the growing legend of Spencer Lee

[WhiteCloud]

So hard to know the skill level of people in international freestyle.  The league needs a season and everyone wrestling a lot more matches.  Compared to high school or ncaa, we are guessing based on months and years in the past.  When someone top ranked loses to someone lower ranked, it's not even considered a real upset since it happens so frequently.

[D3 for LU]

... AND here we are.

(Please continue, professors! )

D3

[nhs67]

10 hours ago, bnwtwg said:

It's not surprising whatsoever. Primary points are based off previous year's championship results at the weight currently being contested (eg. Dake would have 0 seeding points at 86) and supplemental points from rankings series (4 total tournies this year not heavily attended by any single athlete) + continental tourneys (1 per region [Pan-Am, Euros, Asian, Oceania, African]).

Out of the Team USA roster only 12 total tourneys were wrestled and none more than twice. Given the turnover of the team and the fact that a couple guys were wrapping up their junior year studying for the SAT, the numbers don't lie.

 

		Zagreb	Tiran	Mongolia	Pan-Ams	Budapest	Total
		(Feb)	(Feb)	(May)	(May)	(July)
57	Spencer	1st	---	---	---	---	1
61	Forrest	---	---	---	1st	---	1
65	Woods	---	3rd	---	---	---	1
70	Duke	---	---	---	---	---	0
74	Carr	2nd	---	---	---	3rd	2
79	Haines	---	---	---	---	---	0
86	Zahid	1st	---	---	1st	---	2
92	Hidlay	---	---	---	1st	1st	2
97	Snyder	1st	3rd	---	---	---	2
125	Pindrickson	---	---	---	1st	---	1

 

BOOM!  Got me, right there.  Cheerios all over my screen.

[Eagle26]

It seems crazy that we only have 4 guys seeded and one of them is 8th. But I get that is what the numbers give us and I don’t mind having a set criteria like that. I predict we out perform our seeds but not by much. We definitely are experiencing a changing of the guard and I’m not sure if some of the young guys are ready just yet. By 2028, the rest of the world better look out though! 

[bnwtwg]

2 hours ago, nhs67 said:

BOOM!  Got me, right there.  Cheerios all over my screen.

That sort of behavior is uncivilized and belongs in the zoo!

[bnwtwg]

8 minutes ago, Eagle26 said:

It seems crazy that we only have 4 guys seeded and one of them is 8th. But I get that is what the numbers give us and I don’t mind having a set criteria like that. I predict we out perform our seeds but not by much. We definitely are experiencing a changing of the guard and I’m not sure if some of the young guys are ready just yet. By 2028, the rest of the world better look out though! 

No one would have predicted Jordan Burroughs, some random American kid who barely won NCAAs twice to become the best wrestler in US history.

No one would have predicted Kyle Snyder to bounce back from a juniors bronze + getting pinned in 90 seconds to becoming the P4P best in the world from 2015-17.

No one would have predicted college J'Den Cox to even make OTT or WTT finals at any point with his style, much less have stellar international success.

No one would have predicted David Taylor, who was never better than 3rd best domestically at any weight, to pack on 33 pounds and at one point become the P4P best in the world.

No one would have predicted Gable Steveson to enter his first senior international tournament and go absolutely gangbusters on the olympic bracket. Then again, no one predicted Wyatt Pindrickson to beat him a few months ago.

There is precedent. It is an intimidating changing of the guard, and following our renaissance generation is certainly intimidating. But if I have learned anything this season, it's that this crop of young guns is cold as ice and not afraid of the lights on the big stage.

Edited 4 hours ago by bnwtwg

[Mr. PeanutButter]

Why is Gulomon seeded above Aman at 57kg? They are both Olympic bronze medalists but, to my knowledge, Gulomon hasn't competed this year and Aman has ranking series points

[Jon_Kozak]

21 minutes ago, Mr. PeanutButter said:

Why is Gulomon seeded above Aman at 57kg? They are both Olympic bronze medalists but, to my knowledge, Gulomon hasn't competed this year and Aman has ranking series points

Aman - 26,000 + 3,000 (Olympics) + 5,200 (3rd place at Mongolian Open) = 34,200
Abdullaev - 26,000 +3,000 (Olympics) + 4,000 + 3,000 (8th Place at Asians) = 36,000

 

You can see how UWW applies Rankings Points by competition here: https://cdn.uww.org/2024-01/ranking_series_rules.pdf

[Mr. PeanutButter]

1 minute ago, Jon_Kozak said:

Aman - 26,000 + 3,000 (Olympics) + 5,200 (3rd place at Mongolian Open) = 34,200
Abdullaev - 26,000 +3,000 (Olympics) + 4,000 + 3,000 (8th Place at Asians) = 36,000

 

You can see how UWW applies Rankings Points by competition here: https://cdn.uww.org/2024-01/ranking_series_rules.pdf

Thanks Mr. Wizard

[Wrasslin]

55 minutes ago, Mr. PeanutButter said:

Why is Gulomon seeded above Aman at 57kg? They are both Olympic bronze medalists but, to my knowledge, Gulomon hasn't competed this year and Aman has ranking series points

 

32 minutes ago, Jon_Kozak said:

Aman - 26,000 + 3,000 (Olympics) + 5,200 (3rd place at Mongolian Open) = 34,200
Abdullaev - 26,000 +3,000 (Olympics) + 4,000 + 3,000 (8th Place at Asians) = 36,000

 

You can see how UWW applies Rankings Points by competition here: https://cdn.uww.org/2024-01/ranking_series_rules.pdf

UWW ranking points are a little weird. To break down the above so they're understandable, it's based on the tournament (A,B,C level...A being highest) and # of competitors in those tournaments. Both received 26,000 points from Olympic bronze plus 3,000 bonus points for the 57kg bracket having 13-16 competitors in an "A" event (Olympics). Aman placed 3rd in Ranking series Mongolian Open "C" event, which gave him 5,200 points. Because there were only 10 competitors, he doesn't get bonus points.

Here's the crazy part...Aman didn't wrestle in Senior Asian Championships, whereas Gulomjon did, and he placed 8th without winning a match! By fortuitous draw, he skipped qualification round and was drawn into Quarters where he lost to Kalzhan of Kazakhstan who was then beaten in the next round and Gulomjon was eliminated,but got 8th having wrestled (and lost) one match. Because continental championships are "B" events, points are worth more than ranking "C" events, so he received 4,000 for 8th, plus a bonus of 3,000 points for having 13-16 competitors in the bracket, so 7,000 total points. Not bad for losing a match! 

Good news is, they're 2 and 3 seeds, so it really matters very little as they'll eventually meet in semis if they win out. 

Edited 3 hours ago by Wrasslin

[bnwtwg]

7 minutes ago, Wrasslin said:

 

UWW ranking points are a little weird. To break down the above so they're understandable, it's based on the tournament (A,B,C level...A being highest) and # of competitors in those tournaments. Both received 26,000 points from Olympic bronze plus 3,000 bonus points for the 57kg bracket having 13-16 competitors in an "A" event (Olympics). Aman placed 3rd in Ranking series Mongolian Open "C" event, which gave him 5,200 points. Because there were only 10 competitors, he doesn't get bonus points.

Here's the crazy part...Aman didn't wrestle in Senior Asian Championships, whereas Gulomjon did, and he placed 8th without winning a match! By fortuitous draw, he skipped qualification round and was drawn into Quarters where he lost to Kalzhan of Kazakhstan who was then beaten in the next round and Gulomjon was eliminated,but got 8th having wrestled (and lost) one match. Because continental championships are "B" events, points are worth more than ranking "C" events, so he received 4,000 for 8th, plus a bonus of 3,000 points for having 13-16 competitors in the bracket, so 7,000 total points. Not bad for losing a match! 

Good news is, they're 2 and 3 seeds, so it really matters very little as they'll eventually meet in semis if they win out. 

But what happens if the points are tied at the end of the regulation season?

Is there....

 

 

 

Criteria?

[Eagle26]

3 hours ago, bnwtwg said:

No one would have predicted Jordan Burroughs, some random American kid who barely won NCAAs twice to become the best wrestler in US history.

No one would have predicted Kyle Snyder to bounce back from a juniors bronze + getting pinned in 90 seconds to becoming the P4P best in the world from 2015-17.

No one would have predicted college J'Den Cox to even make OTT or WTT finals at any point with his style, much less have stellar international success.

No one would have predicted David Taylor, who was never better than 3rd best domestically at any weight, to pack on 33 pounds and at one point become the P4P best in the world.

No one would have predicted Gable Steveson to enter his first senior international tournament and go absolutely gangbusters on the olympic bracket. Then again, no one predicted Wyatt Pindrickson to beat him a few months ago.

There is precedent. It is an intimidating changing of the guard, and following our renaissance generation is certainly intimidating. But if I have learned anything this season, it's that this crop of young guns is cold as ice and not afraid of the lights on the big stage.

I totally agree. I wouldn’t be shocked if someone bursts on to the scene with world gold in their first ever senior world championships. As you point out, we’ve seen it happen many times and I think it can be a bit of an advantage not being the guy who has been scouted for years. However, as you also pointed, you can’t really predict it. I think’s possible that we get our youngest male world champ this year. I’m just saying if I had to put money on my top picks, I wouldn’t be bold enough to make that call. I sure hope I’m wrong about that though!