Mizzou next year

[MizzouFan01]

This is my guess on what the lineup could look like next year. Hopefully Selzter can carve out a starting role. He was ahead of Moore before weight issue cost him his spot. 
 

Surtin

Moore

Edmond

Gioffre

Steed/Conway loser goes 165

KOT

Hawks/Whiting

R Elam

? no clue on 285

We have a pretty good class coming in, most likely the majority RS, but you never know. Big Elam graduates leaving a big hole, doubtful but maybe we get a transfer in the portal. 

[flyingcement]

There was talk about Connor McGonagle going to Missouri - but with Moore and Seltzer - it's not a huge need, while you may still be getting an upgrade.  

For 285, Askren mentioned Wyatt Hendrickson, but others here mentioned that Hendrickson said to the contrary in his interview (and this would also be logistically difficult from a service academy).  Sounds like Lewis Fernandes is moving onto his post-wrestling career as well.  

If Christian Carroll is the man next year for the Sooners, I wonder if Konner Doucet could be on the market for a new team.

Michael Wolfgram has another year if he chooses to use it and blue chip recruit Rune Lawrence comes to Morgantown next season with a high likelihood of starting as a true freshman.  Wolfgram could be another guy to fill the need for a year.

Jim Mullen starts for Va Tech next year also - Hunter Catka could be on the market.

Edited March 24 by flyingcement

[CHROMEBIRD]

Is 165 a tough cut for KOT? Mostly I'm wondering if he'll end up in tweener territory down the road in freestyle.

[MizzouFan01]

21 minutes ago, flyingcement said:

There was talk about Connor McGonagle going to Missouri - but with Moore and Seltzer - it's not a huge need, while you may still be getting an upgrade.  

For 285, Askren mentioned Wyatt Hendrickson, but others here mentioned that Hendrickson said to the contrary in his interview (and this would also be logistically difficult from a service academy).  Sounds like Lewis Fernandes is moving onto his post-wrestling career as well.  

If Christian Carroll is the man next year for the Sooners, I wonder if Konner Doucet could be on the market for a new team.

Michael Wolfgram has another year if he chooses to use it and blue chip recruit Rune Lawrence comes to Morgantown next season with a high likelihood of starting as a true freshman.  Wolfgram could be another guy to fill the need for a year.

Jim Mullen starts for Va Tech next year also - Hunter Catka could be on the market.

I’d welcome McGonagle with open arms. More competition. Seltzer can’t make 133 and he’d be a huge upgrade on Moore. 

[Crotalus]

Is 165 a tough cut for KOT? Mostly I'm wondering if he'll end up in tweener territory down the road in freestyle.

I'm not sure that it is. His first few years he was small for 165, but he filled out this year. I suspect he plans on staying at 74kg for freestyle so it makes sense to stay put.

Any chance Rocky would move up? He's rather skinny but tall. He'd have to put on some decent weight to compete at Hwy, but I'm sure he wrestles with his brother quite a bit and has a feel for what the transition would be like (I'd prefer he stays at 197, just spit balling).

[MidwestMan]

10 minutes ago, Crotalus said:

I'm not sure that it is. His first few years he was small for 165, but he filled out this year. I suspect he plans on staying at 74kg for freestyle so it makes sense to stay put.

Any chance Rocky would move up? He's rather skinny but tall. He'd have to put on some decent weight to compete at Hwy, but I'm sure he wrestles with his brother quite a bit and has a feel for what the transition would be like (I'd prefer he stays at 197, just spit balling).

If KO could/would stay at 165, I wonder if Whiting or Hawks could make the cut down to 174.  That would solve the problem of the log jam they are in and allow to use both.  I was thinking the same about Rocky, but he'd really need to "pack it on", like Bastida.  Sinclair will be arriving and could slot somewhere.

All this won't matter unless this team can get more gritty.  Sure seems like when it got to "nut cutting time", Mizzou got "neutered!"  I've never seen so many Tigers get teched, or seem to have quit mentally, before the season was over.  Ok, there was some illness on the team towards the end.  Performance was starting to slide before that.  Could blame it on HEW.  In the end, who is responsible for the psyche of the team?  The conditioning?  The development and also the ability to adjust a wrestlers deficiency through drilling, etc...  Smith has shown he can be a good recruiter.  But, how many Tigers come to Mizzou as "great" wrestlers, and leave as just "good" wrestlers?  Hell, Cornell is national runner up.  Hats off to their coaching staff.  Tell me what is keeping Mizzou from being a Cornell.

I've already typed enough but I could go on, believe me.  Personally, I'm ready for chapter 2.

 

[MizzouFan01]

36 minutes ago, Crotalus said:

I'm not sure that it is. His first few years he was small for 165, but he filled out this year. I suspect he plans on staying at 74kg for freestyle so it makes sense to stay put.

Any chance Rocky would move up? He's rather skinny but tall. He'd have to put on some decent weight to compete at Hwy, but I'm sure he wrestles with his brother quite a bit and has a feel for what the transition would be like (I'd prefer he stays at 197, just spit balling).

If Rocky moves up, that could clear room for one of the 184’s we have. Whiting, Harmon and incoming #1 220 Sinclair could battle for 197. I would assume Sinclair RS but if he’s the best option then I wouldnt be nervous about letting him go. 

[MizzouFan01]

2 minutes ago, MidwestMan said:

If KO could/would stay at 165, I wonder if Whiting or Hawks could make the cut down to 174.  That would solve the problem of the log jam they are in and allow to use both.  I was thinking the same about Rocky, but he'd really need to "pack it on", like Bastida.  Sinclair will be arriving and could slot somewhere.

All this won't matter unless this team can get more gritty.  Sure seems like when it got to "nut cutting time", Mizzou got "neutered!"  I've never seen so many Tigers get teched, or seem to have quit mentally, before the season was over.  Ok, there was some illness on the team towards the end.  Performance was starting to slide before that.  Could blame it on HEW.  In the end, who is responsible for the psyche of the team?  The conditioning?  The development and also the ability to adjust a wrestlers deficiency through drilling, etc...  Smith has shown he can be a good recruiter.  But, how many Tigers come to Mizzou as "great" wrestlers, and leave as just "good" wrestlers?  Hell, Cornell is national runner up.  Hats off to their coaching staff.  Tell me what is keeping Mizzou from being a Cornell.

I've already typed enough but I could go on, believe me.  Personally, I'm ready for chapter 2.

 

Absolutely this. We have good to great recruits, we have the staff, what we don’t have at least this year, is wrestlers who want it bad enough. We don’t have killers so to speak. Maybe HEW was the problem for most of the lineup, I don’t know. Maybe we need to have our guys wrestle more, could be a number of things. But the nut cutting time is exactly what is wrong with us. We could’ve had 5-AA’s if Hawks could’ve gotten off bottom and Edmond finished his shots. We had the talent to come home with a trophy, but like in years past, we don’t perform on the big stage. 

[MidwestMan]

Now I guess we will see if Edmonds solves his Dr Jekle, Mr Hyde approach to takedowns.  He just needs to get in shape and keep coming Mesenbrink style.  I so wanted to see him, and Hawks AA, but then we know "the rest of the story!"

[Show_Me]

13 minutes ago, MidwestMan said:

All this won't matter unless this team can get more gritty.  Sure seems like when it got to "nut cutting time", Mizzou got "neutered!"  I've never seen so many Tigers get teched, or seem to have quit mentally, before the season was over.  Could blame it on HEW.  In Personally, I'm ready for chapter 2.

This.  I was in attendance @ KC and most fans were as perplexed as me.

The Mizzou schedule is a joke.  No CKLV, Midlands, Scuffle, Soldier Salute, South Beach Duals, or Collegiate Wrestling Duals.  Most of our guys either didn’t have (or) barely had the 15 required matches for RPI going into Big 12.

HEW was obvious with Mauller & Mocco.  Wonder if that apathy was contagious.

I am also more than ready for Chapter 2.

[Crotalus]

I don't know. Smith has gotten a lot of credit over the years for taking lower ranked guys and turning them into AAs. And the "great" recruits in terms of blue chip guys are pretty far between. Some guys have definitely plateaued, but not a lot that have gone from "great" to just "good". This year did feel like a team lacking any fight, though.

[The_KC_Godfather]

I don’t know much about how the current assistant/associate head coaches do things, but it feels like ever since Clemsen and Sammie Henson left, the intensity has not been there. If you watch the All Access Mizzou Flo film, you can see the difference in intensity and fight. Seemed like there was an expectation, and the wrestlers “wanted” to be there. Love the team but honestly both Elam’s looked like they didn’t want to be there at all.

Seems like we need a high intensity “hype’r” to get the guys pumped.

[MidwestMan]

Mocco was one of Carr's only loses and looked like the "real deal" his frosh season.  I can remember being so excited when I saw that Hart had committed to the Tigers from St. Ed's.  How did that all end?  Jacques never reached his potential, and much like Mauller, had the physical tools but never adjusted their style.  Eierman left the Tigers because he felt he couldn't reach his potential at Mizzou.  I don't know if that was technically, or culture related.  How much credit can Smith and crew take for KO success when we know where the product started?  Great coaches keep raising the bar so their athletes will keep reaching.  I look at Iowa State and Northern Iowa and their kids just seem a bit tougher, but then look at their coaching staffs and you see why.  I'd love to see this grit with the Tigers. 

[MizzouFan01]

Coming into the year there was big expectations for the Tigers, with 5 returning AAs and a 2x Champ we were expected to bring home a trophy. We know it didn’t pan out, but that started immediately. Mauller at 157 wasn’t ideal, Seltzer couldn’t maintain 133, Whiting wins the spot only to have it taken away right before B12s, the “flu” or whatnot that happened towards the end. Just seems like the season was doomed before it began. Rocky missed a good portion of matches. Hopefully next year it gets better. I still believe in Smith and Company but we gotta right the ship. 

[Wrestej]

As a fan I’m heart broken over how the team finished this year, will take time to digest.  Way too early to figure anything out about next year.  I don’t know what it would take to have Ben or Max come on to staff or take over but IMO that would be the biggest boost for the program.  They have a clear understanding of what it takes to prepare physically and mentally for the right time.  They also have a great understanding of breaking down opponents and how to maximize their wrestlers chances of winning.  
Don’t get me wrong, I love the way Maple works with the guys.  Also not bashing Coach Smith.  I have nothing but respect for Smith.  He has brought this program out of the ashes (when he started) to very respected.  But to get to the next level (top five year in year out) there obviously has to be some kind of change somewhere.  

[NorthCarolina]

Outside perspective: 

 

Y’all are going to be fine. Y’all were on pace to do well all year long until that sickness hit. Keegan even eluded to this in his post NCAAs interview. (Side note how can you not love that kid?) If the sickness doesn’t occur, who knows what happens. Coach Smith and crew will have y’all right in the trophy hunt again next year. 
 

Sinclair is going to be able to compete from Day 1 next year. Rocky should go HWT and insert Sinclair into the lineup. 

 

 

[MidwestMan]

I know my comments are critical of the current Mizzou wrestling edition, but you don't get people commenting about the state of a program unless that program has reached the point of relevance.  There was a day when Tiger wrestling fans would have been ecstatic with an 11th place finish at nationals.  We can thank Coach Smith and his staffs for getting Tiger wrestling to the point where we follow the team religiously, drive to Columbia for home duals and new attendance records, and are a bit spoiled with our climb to what I would call the "2nd highest tier" of the D1 hierarchy.  We are not in the class of the traditional top tier blue bloods yet, but knocking on the door, or at least were knocking on the door.  With success and the accolades that come with it, also comes the expectations and ire that can be that double edged sword when the bottom falls out and fans left wondering, "what the hell happened?"  Now looking to the "24/25" edition, we'll see how this coaching staff meets the challenge.

[MidwestMan]

North Carolina, I sure hope your right, although I'm not buying that the "sickness" was our only problem.  Guess we'll have to revisit this post a year from now.

[flyingcement]

Good point - I wondered if Rocky would go heavy.  He's a very large 197 to begin with

[Wrestej]

28 minutes ago, flyingcement said:

Good point - I wondered if Rocky would go heavy.  He's a very large 197 to begin with

Took his brother 3 years to fill his body adequately for heavy.  They were basically carbon copies of each other.

[Antitroll2828]

Did rocky have a case of HEW this year? Seemed like a different guy , is he definitely coming back?

[MizzouFan01]

Just now, Antitroll2828 said:

Did rocky have a case of HEW this year? Seemed like a different guy , is he definitely coming back?

Hopefully. Someone with more knowledge may know more than me, but I haven’t heard anything. He performs in March when it matters. I think he can win next year. 

[The_KC_Godfather]

What is HEW?

[STLBOY]

Had Enough Wrestling 

[MidwestMan]

1 minute ago, Antitroll2828 said:

Did rocky have a case of HEW this year? Seemed like a different guy , is he definitely coming back?

I was at a watch party with about 20 old wrestlers and coaches and this question was brought up.  Many in the crowd know the Elams from dad's high school and college days, as well as following the boys through their youth and HS days.  Word in the room was both boys were a bit toasty about wrestling, and Rocky has dealt with naggy injury.  Would I be surprised if Rocky left his shoes on the mat?  Not a bit.