Is this what you voted for?

[Caveira]

19 minutes ago, fishbane said:

Even assuming they got this raid in Chicago right, which is not guaranteed, it is only one side of the ICE raids.  The other side is harder to get behind.  Constitution rights being violated/denied.  Hispanic Americans being detained and arrested based on nothing.

Here is the story of an Alabama who has been detained twice by ICE in raids whilst working construction. They had no right to detain him even once and they wouldn't accept a REAL ID as proof of citizenship.

https://ij.org/case/alabama-construction-site-raids/

In what numbers  boss.   Give me a good arrest/deportation % vs bad 

 

if the left lets in a Zillion every cycle and complains about 0.01% I can see their strategy plain as day.  
 

cry about one offs 

 

I’ve  prolly shown 200 illegals killing or maiming Chicago based Americans alone.  Can u get to 200 ?

Edited 18 hours ago by Caveira

[fishbane]

8 minutes ago, Caveira said:

In what numbers  boss.   Give me a good arrest/deportation % vs bad 

 

if the left lets in a Zillion every cycle and companies about 0.01% I can see their strategy plain as day.  
 

cry about one offs 

 

I’ve  prolly shown 200 illegals killing or maiming Chicago based Americans alone.  Can u get to 200 ?

Even assuming what you say is true, which it likely isn't, 200 illegal immigrants maiming and killing in Chicago does not give ICE the right to raid construction sites in Alabama simply because there are Hispanic workers present.

That man was detained by ICE 2x in less than a month.  May 21st and again on June 12th.  I'm just guessing, but I don't think you would be all about the ICE raids if you were being pulled off your job by ICE at that rate.  

[Caveira]

7 minutes ago, fishbane said:

Even assuming what you say is true, which it likely isn't, 200 illegal immigrants maiming and killing in Chicago does not give ICE the right to raid construction sites in Alabama simply because there are Hispanic workers present.

That man was detained by ICE 2x in less than a month.  May 21st and again on June 12th.  I'm just guessing, but I don't think you would be all about the ICE raids if you were being pulled off your job by ICE at that rate.  

You’re missing the math of the cycle.  If the Ds consistently let in however many zillions they can…..  And make it impossible to deport them. Do you see how the math ends ?

 

Also you are not showing any evidence they are arresting or detaining citizens in enough volume to statistically deviate from any president in the history of earth. 
 

kicking out illegals is what Americans voted  for 

Edited 17 hours ago by Caveira

[fishbane]

10 minutes ago, Caveira said:

You’re missing the math of the cycle.  If the Ds consistently let in however many zillions they can…..  And make it impossible to deport them. Do you see how the math ends ?

 

Also you are not showing any evidence they are arresting or detaining citizens in enough volume to statistically deviate from any president in the history of earth. 
 

kicking out illegals is what Americans voted  for 

I understand the math.  There are nearly 70 million Hispanics living in the US.  The vast majority of them are US citizens.  Whilst I am sure many Americans voted to deport those without legal status, I am far less convinced that many voted to eliminate the constitutional rights of Hispanics working in construction, agriculture, and other manual labor occupations. Nothing you said justifies it, and moreover is simply not allowed under the constitution.

[Caveira]

29 minutes ago, fishbane said:

I understand the math.  There are nearly 70 million Hispanics living in the US.  The vast majority of them are US citizens.  Whilst I am sure many Americans voted to deport those without legal status, I am far less convinced that many voted to eliminate the constitutional rights of Hispanics working in construction, agriculture, and other manual labor occupations. Nothing you said justifies it, and moreover is simply not allowed under the constitution.

Whom is deporting citizens in any volume?  Show me that   

I’ll bet that illegal immigrants kill more U.S. citizens than citizens who are wrongly deported.

I’ll say it again: show me I’m wrong.

I’ll bet illegal immigrants kill more U.S. citizens than citizens who are wrongly deported.

Edited 17 hours ago by Caveira

[Tripnsweep]

1 hour ago, fishbane said:

I understand the math.  There are nearly 70 million Hispanics living in the US.  The vast majority of them are US citizens.  Whilst I am sure many Americans voted to deport those without legal status, I am far less convinced that many voted to eliminate the constitutional rights of Hispanics working in construction, agriculture, and other manual labor occupations. Nothing you said justifies it, and moreover is simply not allowed under the constitution.

This is too advanced for little Jimmy to understand. 

[Caveira]

5 minutes ago, Tripnsweep said:

This is too advanced for little Jimmy to understand. 

He commented nothing on the matter at hand 

[Tripnsweep]

Little Jimmy did you forget to switch accounts again? It looks like you did. 

[GreatWhiteNorth]

4 hours ago, Caveira said:

You’re missing the math of the cycle.  If the Ds consistently let in however many zillions they can…..  And make it impossible to deport them. Do you see how the math ends ?

Also you are not showing any evidence they are arresting or detaining citizens in enough volume to statistically deviate from any president in the history of earth. 
 

kicking out illegals is what Americans voted for 

That's quite a trifecta:

1. Do we see how the math ends
   Not sure what that is even supposed to mean. You and Big-broad sharing the sauce tonight.
2. Any president in the history of earth
   OK. See #1 above
3. Kicking out illegals is what Americans voted for
   No. You silly drunkard. That's not what we were voting for at all. Review the ballot.

[Bigbrog]

10 hours ago, fishbane said:

Even assuming what you say is true, which it likely isn't, 200 illegal immigrants maiming and killing in Chicago does not give ICE the right to raid construction sites in Alabama simply because there are Hispanic workers present.

That man was detained by ICE 2x in less than a month.  May 21st and again on June 12th.  I'm just guessing, but I don't think you would be all about the ICE raids if you were being pulled off your job by ICE at that rate.  

This makes me wonder if you have looked into the full story or care to take into context of what happened in totality.  I'd be all for agreeing that this isn't a good look IF ICE wasn't able to arrest any of the people detained in the raid.  Don't you think if you are working with and/or hanging out with a bunch of people who are here illegally that maybe, JUST maybe you are going to get caught up in these raids??  

What I don't understand is the line of thinking that what ICE is doing is SO bad because a few, and I mean VERY few, citizens are getting detained in these raids versus ALL the good they are doing by capturing and removing very bad people and quite frankly anyone who is here illegally.

[Caveira]

6 minutes ago, Bigbrog said:

This makes me wonder if you have looked into the full story or care to take into context of what happened in totality.  I'd be all for agreeing that this isn't a good look IF ICE wasn't able to arrest any of the people detained in the raid.  Don't you think if you are working with and/or hanging out with a bunch of people who are here illegally that maybe, JUST maybe you are going to get caught up in these raids??  

What I don't understand is the line of thinking that what ICE is doing is SO bad because a few, and I mean VERY few, citizens are getting detained in these raids versus ALL the good they are doing by capturing and removing very bad people and quite frankly anyone who is here illegally.

Is there a difference between detained and arrested?

[Bigbrog]

9 minutes ago, Caveira said:

Is there a difference between detained and arrested?

Huge difference!  I have a feeling you know this, but for those that don't, in the most basic terms...detained is usually when someone may be handcuffed, usually for the officer and individuals safety until more investigation can be done to see if in fact a crime may have been committed...if the LEO feels no crime was committed the detained person is released, usually on the spot...if a person is arrested it is usually because the LEO has enough evidence that a crime is in fact occurred, they are then read their Mirranda rights, brought to the jail for further processing, and referred to the DA for crime, or crimes the officers suspect the person of committing.

Edited 7 hours ago by Bigbrog

[fishbane]

16 minutes ago, Bigbrog said:

Huge difference!  I have a feeling you know this, but for those that don't, in the most basic terms...detained is usually when someone may be handcuffed, usually for the officer and individuals safety until more investigation can be done to see if in fact a crime may have been committed...if the LEO feels no crime was committed the detained person is released, usually on the spot...if a person is arrested it is usually because the LEO has enough evidence that a crime is in fact occurred, they are then read their Mirranda rights, brought to the jail for further processing, and referred to the DA for crime, or crimes the officers suspect the person of committing.

Both a detention and an arrest are seizures under the 4th amendment. Detaining someone with particularized facts tying that person to criminal activity is not constitutional.  Being Hispanic and working in a particular profession is not enough.  These ice detentions can last days. There often is little difference between a detention and an arrest.  If law enforcement cuffs a person without evidence, holds them for days, and releases them without charges they have still been arrested regardless of missing all the usual stuff you listed.

What I am talking about here is ICE going onto private property without a warrant and detaining anyone that looks Latino.  The second time Leo Garcia Venegas was detained he was the only person working in the house.  How could ICE have any particularized facts that he was an illegal immigrant to detain him?  How could they enter a private building without a warrant?  They simply didn’t.  He was a US citizen.  ICE had verified this fact a few weeks earlier when they done the same thing to him at a different construction site.

[JimmySpeaks]

42 minutes ago, Bigbrog said:

Huge difference!  I have a feeling you know this, but for those that don't, in the most basic terms...detained is usually when someone may be handcuffed, usually for the officer and individuals safety until more investigation can be done to see if in fact a crime may have been committed...if the LEO feels no crime was committed the detained person is released, usually on the spot...if a person is arrested it is usually because the LEO has enough evidence that a crime is in fact occurred, they are then read their Mirranda rights, brought to the jail for further processing, and referred to the DA for crime, or crimes the officers suspect the person of committing.

This is a nothing burger.  Hardly happens at all. Another attempt from the left to turn a 1% issue into a big deal. 

[Caveira]

21 minutes ago, fishbane said:

Both a detention and an arrest are seizures under the 4th amendment. Detaining someone with particularized facts tying that person to criminal activity is not constitutional.  Being Hispanic and working in a particular profession is not enough.  These ice detentions can last days. There often is little difference between a detention and an arrest.  If law enforcement cuffs a person without evidence, holds them for days, and releases them without charges they have still been arrested regardless of missing all the usual stuff you listed.

What I am talking about here is ICE going onto private property without a warrant and detaining anyone that looks Latino.  The second time Leo Garcia Venegas was detained he was the only person working in the house.  How could ICE have any particularized facts that he was an illegal immigrant to detain him?  How could they enter a private building without a warrant?  They simply didn’t.  He was a US citizen.  ICE had verified this fact a few weeks earlier when they done the same thing to him at a different construction site.

I’ve asked people to cite volume of this activity and no one does.  I’ve also stated that illegals murder more citizens than citizens that are unlawfully detained or arrested.   Prove me wrong.  

[fishbane]

1 minute ago, Caveira said:

I’ve asked people to cite volume of this activity and no one does.  I’ve also stated that illegals murder more citizens than citizens that are unlawfully detained or arrested.   Prove me wrong.  

That wasn’t what you had asked.  You asked to cite volume of US citizens being deported.  Which was a straw man as no one had alleged the removal of US. Citizens.  I had posted instances of unlawful detentions and arrests, which are also unconstitutional.

The two links I posted showed 5 citizens being arrested/detained.  It will be difficult to get an estimate for the number of illegal detentions and arrests.  The data isn’t readily available.  How many US citizens were murdered by illegal immigrants in 2024 and so far this year?

[red viking]

Did any of you vote for the dollar's value to plummet 10% in only 9 months? 

https://www.cnbc.com/2025/10/01/dollar-falls-on-us-government-shutdown-now-on-pace-for-worst-annual-decline-in-22-years.html

[Caveira]

9 minutes ago, fishbane said:

That wasn’t what you had asked.  You asked to cite volume of US citizens being deported.  Which was a straw man as no one had alleged the removal of US. Citizens.  I had posted instances of unlawful detentions and arrests, which are also unconstitutional.

The two links I posted showed 5 citizens being arrested/detained.  It will be difficult to get an estimate for the number of illegal detentions and arrests.  The data isn’t readily available.  How many US citizens were murdered by illegal immigrants in 2024 and so far this year?

Here are six instances from 2024… including a 12 year old … a few. murderers who were deported multiple times …. 

1. Laken Riley
   • Victim: Laken Riley, a 22-year-old nursing student.
   • Alleged perpetrator: Jose Ibarra, an immigrant who unlawfully entered the U.S. in 2022.
   • Circumstances:Ibarra was found guilty of murdering Riley while she was jogging on the University of Georgia campus in February 2024.
   • Source: BBC.
2. Jocelyn Nungaray
   • Victim: Jocelyn Nungaray, a 12-year-old girl in Houston, Texas.
   • Alleged perpetrators: Johan Jose Rangel Martinez and Franklin Jose Pena Ramos, both Venezuelan nationals.
   • Circumstances:Nungaray was found strangled in a creek in June 2024. Both suspects were charged with capital murder and were in the U.S. illegally.
   • Source: New York Post.
3. Rachel Morin
   • Victim: Rachel Morin, a 37-year-old mother of five in Maryland.
   • Alleged perpetrator: Victor Antonio Martinez-Hernandez, a Salvadoran immigrant who entered the country illegally.
   • Circumstances: The Harford County Sheriff's Office linked Martinez-Hernandez to the murder of Morin, who was found dead on a hiking trail in August 2023. He was arrested in Tulsa, Oklahoma, in August 2024.
   • Source: New York Post.
4. Jorge Peralta and Grayson Davis
   • Victim: Grayson Christopher Davis, 29, in Bastrop County, Texas.
   • Alleged perpetrator: Jorge Miguel Peralta, an illegal immigrant who had been deported multiple times.
   • Circumstances: In October 2024, Peralta was driving drunk and caused a multi-vehicle car crash that killed Davis. Peralta attempted to flee the scene.
   • Source: Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR).
5. Sebastian Zapeta and Debrina Kawam
   • Victim: Debrina Kawam, 57, in New York City.
   • Alleged perpetrator:Sebastian Zapeta, a Guatemalan national who had been deported in 2018 and subsequently re-entered illegally.
   • Circumstances: In December 2024, Zapeta allegedly set fire to Kawam, who was sleeping on a subway train, and watched her perish.
   • Source: Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR).
      
   • Case: Murder of Larisha Sharell Thompson
   • Victim: Larisha Sharell Thompson, a 40-year-old mother of two in South Carolina.
   • Alleged perpetrators: Six illegal immigrants from Honduras, including individuals as young as 13 and 14, were arrested and charged.
   • Circumstances: In May 2024, Thompson was fatally shot in a random, attempted carjacking while on her way to meet friends. The suspects were later linked to a separate burglary attempt using the same firearm.
   • Source: Reporting on the arrests was covered by multiple outlets, and U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) confirmed placing detainers on the suspects. 

[fishbane]

2 minutes ago, Caveira said:

 

Here are six instances from 2024… including a 12 year old … a few. murderers who were deported multiple times …. 

1. Laken Riley
   • Victim: Laken Riley, a 22-year-old nursing student.
   • Alleged perpetrator: Jose Ibarra, an immigrant who unlawfully entered the U.S. in 2022.
   • Circumstances:Ibarra was found guilty of murdering Riley while she was jogging on the University of Georgia campus in February 2024.
   • Source: BBC.
2. Jocelyn Nungaray
   • Victim: Jocelyn Nungaray, a 12-year-old girl in Houston, Texas.
   • Alleged perpetrators: Johan Jose Rangel Martinez and Franklin Jose Pena Ramos, both Venezuelan nationals.
   • Circumstances:Nungaray was found strangled in a creek in June 2024. Both suspects were charged with capital murder and were in the U.S. illegally.
   • Source: New York Post.
3. Rachel Morin
   • Victim: Rachel Morin, a 37-year-old mother of five in Maryland.
   • Alleged perpetrator: Victor Antonio Martinez-Hernandez, a Salvadoran immigrant who entered the country illegally.
   • Circumstances: The Harford County Sheriff's Office linked Martinez-Hernandez to the murder of Morin, who was found dead on a hiking trail in August 2023. He was arrested in Tulsa, Oklahoma, in August 2024.
   • Source: New York Post.
4. Jorge Peralta and Grayson Davis
   • Victim: Grayson Christopher Davis, 29, in Bastrop County, Texas.
   • Alleged perpetrator: Jorge Miguel Peralta, an illegal immigrant who had been deported multiple times.
   • Circumstances: In October 2024, Peralta was driving drunk and caused a multi-vehicle car crash that killed Davis. Peralta attempted to flee the scene.
   • Source: Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR).
5. Sebastian Zapeta and Debrina Kawam
   • Victim: Debrina Kawam, 57, in New York City.
   • Alleged perpetrator:Sebastian Zapeta, a Guatemalan national who had been deported in 2018 and subsequently re-entered illegally.
   • Circumstances: In December 2024, Zapeta allegedly set fire to Kawam, who was sleeping on a subway train, and watched her perish.
   • Source: Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR).
      
   • Case: Murder of Larisha Sharell Thompson
   • Victim: Larisha Sharell Thompson, a 40-year-old mother of two in South Carolina.
   • Alleged perpetrators: Six illegal immigrants from Honduras, including individuals as young as 13 and 14, were arrested and charged.
   • Circumstances: In May 2024, Thompson was fatally shot in a random, attempted carjacking while on her way to meet friends. The suspects were later linked to a separate burglary attempt using the same firearm.
   • Source: Reporting on the arrests was covered by multiple outlets, and U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) confirmed placing detainers on the suspects. 

How many US citizens were murdered by illegal immigrants in 2024 and so far this year?

[reversaloffortune]

A single instance of a US citizen being snatched up by ice and detained, then deported is too many.  

[JimmySpeaks]

9 minutes ago, fishbane said:

How many US citizens were murdered by illegal immigrants in 2024 and so far this year?

 Why does it have to be a US citizen that was murdered?  Btw One is too many. 

Edited 5 hours ago by JimmySpeaks

[red viking]

Just now, JimmySpeaks said:

One is too many. 

But thousands murdered by LEGAL immigrants is not? 

[Caveira]

Just now, reversaloffortune said:

A single instance of a US citizen being snatched up by ice and detained, then deported is too many.  

Ice arrested 500+ illegal aliens in the first 100 days of trumps presidency alone….  Illegals who were convicted or accused of murder.   Love that you guys trivialize murder of us citizens for criminals who break the law.   Get in line and come here legally.  

[reversaloffortune]

Except that they weren't.  The people they rounded up were day laborers, pickers, construction crew, restaurant staff, etc.  Maybe stop lying for once in your life.

[Caveira]

4 minutes ago, reversaloffortune said:

Except that they weren't.  The people they rounded up were day laborers, pickers, construction crew, restaurant staff, etc.  Maybe stop lying for once in your life.

Nice no comment on the 500 murderers arrested in the first 100 days.  
 

I know y’all don’t agree.  But being here illegally is a crime.  It carries the penalty of deportation.   Most Americans want them all deported.  This is what Americans voted for.  You just don’t like it.  
 

Unfortunately there will never be a world where 0 citizens are accidentally detained and then released.  Accidents happen.  It’s happened under every single president.   You didn’t care when Obama detained one for over 1000 days.  You just don’t like Trump.  
 

this will be a long 3+ years for you boss.