Confusing time to be a Buckeye fan

[scourge165]

53 minutes ago, MPhillips said:

33yrs VS 18yrs...

Well...33 years vs 30 years overall

They're also about the same age but John Smith is maybe the greatest Wrestler in American History, he had won 5 Team Titles, won 2 himself(the family success also relevant as Pat was a 4X NC under John) and he...pretty much as been the face of Oklahoma State Wrestling for the past almost 40 years. 

 

Tom Ryan Wrestled at Iowa, he won a Title at Ohio State and has had a great deal of success but...if you're telling me that John Smith can be pushed out of the way at Okie State, but Tom Ryan can't at Ohio State in favor of a younger, bigger name as their program stagnates(which I'm not even saying they have, but...they're not gaining ground and they have a LOT of resources they've put into the program)...I'd be skeptical. 

[wrestle87]

2 hours ago, scourge165 said:

I don't really see Cael as a loud personality. Or that as a requirement.

No, but that’s part of what makes the whole penn state situation more mystifying.  

The vast majority of successful coaches are good on the mic and invest in media interaction as part of bolstering draw for their program and the sport.  Cael basically threw them the bird and said “nah I’m not doing that”, but he and bill belichick are just about the only coaches in history who could get away with that and have the powers that be above them be ok with that.

[MPhillips]

54 minutes ago, scourge165 said:

...if you're telling me that John Smith can be pushed out of the way at Okie State, but Tom Ryan can't at Ohio State...

 

Are you're telling me JS didn't retire on his own and was pushed out...

[scourge165]

56 minutes ago, wrestle87 said:

No, but that’s part of what makes the whole penn state situation more mystifying.  

The vast majority of successful coaches are good on the mic and invest in media interaction as part of bolstering draw for their program and the sport.  Cael basically threw them the bird and said “nah I’m not doing that”, but he and bill belichick are just about the only coaches in history who could get away with that and have the powers that be above them be ok with that.

Isn't that pretty much what David Taylor is?

I don't really think you need a loud coach. At least for Wrestling. 

Just one who commands respect, people want to Wrestle for and who is qualified. 

Even Casey Cunningham. I know that's kinda rolled into the PSU thing, but most programs would hire him. He seems pretty laid back. I feel like either type of HC can win, but you're looking more at the older school, Gable, JR Robinson, even John Smith...and it seems like the younger HCs are pretty reserved. 

 

Would you say Schwab is a louder coach?

[scourge165]

3 hours ago, scourge165 said:

I would venture to guess the same was said about John Smith at Okie State.

They don't have to frame it as him being fired. They can frame it as the good old "spending more time with his family." 

 

2 hours ago, MPhillips said:

33yrs VS 18yrs...

Am I "telling you" that John Smith was pushed out?

I don't know...but you're moving the goal posts a bit.

This was the premise I used to start this discussion. You then pointed to the difference in each coaches tenure which...I don't find all that compelling for the reasons I gave and then we ended up back here. 

 

As I said from the start, they could easily frame this as Tom Ryan, who is pretty older for a Wrestling coach...about the same age as John Smith, retiring and they could go with the guy who has had a ton of success, is an Olympic and World Champ and...in this case wrestled for Ohio State.

So no, I'm not telling you that. I'm telling you people have speculated about it. 

I CAN tell you that Coleman Scott was brought in as the heir apparent after there were..."issues" between Smith and Esposito that go beyond the mat but when Okie State had the chance to make a bigger hire, they did so. 

[wrestle87]

25 minutes ago, scourge165 said:

Isn't that pretty much what David Taylor is?

I don't really think you need a loud coach. At least for Wrestling. 

Just one who commands respect, people want to Wrestle for and who is qualified. 

Even Casey Cunningham. I know that's kinda rolled into the PSU thing, but most programs would hire him. He seems pretty laid back. I feel like either type of HC can win, but you're looking more at the older school, Gable, JR Robinson, even John Smith...and it seems like the younger HCs are pretty reserved. 

 

Would you say Schwab is a louder coach?

I think you’re hyperfocusing in the word loud and ignoring the “good on the mic” part.

DT engages with the media 100x more than Cael does.

The modern coach is required to interface with the media in a thoughtful way as part of branding and free marketing for their team.  I think of Ayres, Rob Koll, yes definitely Schwab, T&T, all do a fantastic job of boosting their programs profile by injecting enthusiasm and story behind what they are working on as a team and as individuals.

I will say this, T&T are not towards the top as coaches alone necessarily, but they are amazing storytellers.  They can make a kid who pushes and snaps for 7 minutes sound like the most exciting thing in the world.

[MPhillips]

1 hour ago, scourge165 said:

So no, I'm not telling you that.

Good job...

[TexRef]

On 3/24/2025 at 5:09 PM, pokemonster said:

Yeah I'm sure what they need is a 26 year old who's still obsessed with Pokemon and childhood cartoons and throws his medals in the trash when he loses 

Pull my finger jokes too?