BAC

WKN, how would these numbers change if you threw out Carter's two injury default "losses" last year at Big 10s? My guess is he'd go up to #2 in your first 2 categories (win % and longest win streak), behind only Cael, and might move up one or two places on bonus % too.

I think Carter is being undervalued on this thread, largely because the biggest assets he brings to the table are either not particularly fun to watch (his defense) or not visible to the naked eye (his will to win), and these stats won't show up on a comparison chart. I think the Dake comparison is apt on his defense. He's just incredibly hard to score on. If I were ranking all the four-timers on that score, I'd have him second only to Dake. But the will to win is the big one. Of all the 4-timers, if they are in a zero-takedown match, what are the odds they will prevail? For Carter, I'd put it at about 95%. He's by far and away the best 4x'er on this, which makes him undervalued when you use more measurable stats. Yes, a big part of that is he's an excellent rider while also being nearly impossible to ride. Part is an ability to make mid-match adjustments. But its more than that. In matches decided by 2 points or less, he's 20-1 (actually 20-0 if you exclude his very first match, the 10-9 loss to DJ Washington, which you get the sense he's been avenging ever since). He's 7-0 in matches that went to OT. And if you watch enough of the matches, you start to realize how inevitable it is. It's not that he's unbeatable -- it's that to do so, you need to bring a whole lot more to the table than just being close in skill. Maybe an offense like Brooks/Taylor, or a total package like Dake. But there's no "almost beating" Carter. There's no "whew, that SV match could've gone either way" with Carter. I think that in his mind, his likelihood of winning is just as high in a SV match as it is when he's up 14-0, and the stats bear that out. The only variable is the amount of bonus points, not the chances of prevailing. People talk about how Ferrari was "right there" with Carter, but the truth is, Carter wins that match 20 of 20 times. Keckeisen and McEnelly have a non-zero chance of an upset but are WAY bigger underdogs than the closeness of score of their most recent matches would suggest. I'd put Carter behind Cael, Dake, and *probably* Brooks, but ahead of Smith, Yianni and Stieber.

This is a little off topic but can someone tell me how on earth Figs lost? The kid was like 10-14. I never once heard the name in my life. The kid lost like 3 straight after that and Figs comes back for third. What the heck?

I remember this one when it happened. Tears to my eyes. Captured so many things so profoundly.

Askren's "backward track meet" interview.

125 - McCrone 133 - Rini 141 - Saunders 149 - Abas 157 - Teemer 165- Mulvaney 174 - Incontrera 184 - Rogotzke 197 - Stemmet HWT - Runyon

I'm a fan of Cox, and would have him top 10 overall, but you're overstating it here. Both Taylor and Dake went up from 74kg to 86kg to take on Cox because they couldn't beat Burroughs, but neither (especially Dake) was an actual 86kg'er at that time (2016-17) -- and Cox was huge for the weight. As you know, Dake's been at 74kg/79kg ever since. I don't think you can say Cox's career is better than Dake's because Dake went up 26.5 pounds (!) for ONE year, and lost to Cox in a competitive OTT series, 2 matches to 1. At their respective weights, Dake's career accomplishments are better. Taylor, of course, did later settle into 86kg when the new weight classes (79kg and 92kg) came out, enabling Cox to move up, so the weight differential wasn't as pronounced. But in that brief period of overlap, it was very close between them. The only time they met, I believe, was the 2017 WTT series, which was also 2 matches to 1 -- including the controversial "slick mat" third match. Is it possible that, if Cox stayed at 86kg after 2017 and they didn't add the 2 new weights, "David Taylor may have never made a single team"? Well, anything's possible, but it's more likely that Cox may have never made another team. Taylor, after all, never really hit his stride in freestyle until 2017/2018. Once Taylor took over 86kg, he met, and easily defeated, many of the foreign wrestlers who had defeated Cox at Worlds -- e.g. Makhoev, Sharifov, and most recently, coming out of retirement to beat Ghasempour, who beat Cox at the '21 Worlds. Bottom line, when you look at their full freestyle careers, Taylor's was more accomplished, and that isn't changed by a single 2-1 series on a single day in 2017 when Taylor hadn't yet reached full form. Again, that's not to minimize Cox's own brilliant career. But putting Cox over Dake/Taylor since they lost when they bumped up to take him on, is sort of like putting Taylor over Burroughs based on Taylor's win when Burroughs bumped up to 86kg to take him on a few years ago.

I'd have it Smith, Burroughs, Bruce, Taylor, Dake, Snyder. Yes, I know that's 5. Not sure yet which one I'd drop. Probably Dake, as he lacks an Olympic title. Regarding the others mentioned: Dave Schultz was great, but he doesn't have the titles these others have. Doesn't help that his Olympic title was from the boycott year. Cael is awesome but he has even fewer titles (one). He was never that good at freestyle. Even the year he won, it was an upset as everyone expected Saijidov to torch him as he'd done at the prior worlds, but the Korean upset him in the semis. Kemp is probably next in line after the above 6 guys, but they each have at least 4 world/Olympic titles while Kemp has 3.

I'm pretty sure that was the prior season (the spladle). Earlier that season, Metcalf teched Caldwell, but it was in the all-star dual so it didn't "count".

Agreed. I have huge respect for what Schwab has done. What holds them back, though, is they're more of a dual team than a tournament team. They can take a mid-tier recruit and make him into a top 15 type guy, and do that across the lineup, so that they crush almost everyone in duals. But a top 15 type guy isn't going to score many points at nationals. It's a shame they don't get more high-end recruits, since they've shown that when they land one -- such as Keckeisen -- they can turn him into an absolute monster.

If I'm a wrestling dad, I'd take UNI ten times over before I'd take Iowa. How many top 20 recruiting classes has UNI had in the last 5 years? One, and they were something like 18th or 19th. Yet how's UNI ranked? Fourth, and very nearly knocked off OSU at Big 12s. And they did that with how many Portal transfers? None, to my recollection. NIL funds? Probably close to zero. Loyal recruits forced to transfer because the coach brought in some grad student at his weight? Zero. Compare that to Iowa, which has top 5 recruiting classes year in and year out, plus who knows how many hundreds of thousands of Booster Bucks dropped on Portal transfers. The two teams are very nearly equal. Schwab and his staff coached up this ragtag group of misfits to a top 5 team, with virtually every starter ranked in the top 20, that routed Nebraska 24-9 -- the same Nebraska that torched Iowa at Big 10s. Take away Iowa's Portal mercenaries, and UNI probably holds Iowa to single digits in a dual -- not that we'll ever know, since Brands refuses to schedule them. Plus, you send your kid to Iowa, you know they'll recruit over him in a heartbeat, paying big money for someone who couldn't care less about Iowa to take his spot, shoving your kid off to one of the Dakotas. True, UNI lacks the Iowa fan base and the prestige and patina of the Iowa name, so they can't compete in recruiting. But qualitatively, the truth is that UNI is blowing the doors off of Iowa right now in talent development, and is infinitely more loyal. For recruits who do their homework, the choice is obvious.

I dunno. I do agree with much of this. But I don't share your view that Iowa is doing so wonderfully, and I don't think we need to put on the kid gloves with regard to Iowa. We can respect them without treating them as beyond criticism. In fact, if you believe as I do that a strong and competitive Iowa is good for the program, then we do them a disservice by not pointing out where they are falling short. For example, I don't think it's mean spirited to point out that Iowa is doing a below-average job developing talent. Their assistant coaches aren't talented enough to make their good wrestlers great. They also lack breadth of knowledge, as everyone on staff is either (a) a Brands, or (b) a Brands product who learned most of what he knows from a Brands. They've badly neglected the HWC, which is nearly non-existent, so now they are light years behind PSU in terms of the quality of practice partners. And worst of all, Iowa has badly harmed its culture, cohesion and wrestler loyalty by their extreme reliance on the portal, which they use to not just fill gaps, but also to run loyal longtime teammates out of town in favor of one-year paid wonders who have no real affinity for Iowa. Their recruiting is OK but still substandard, probably because recruits aren't seeing any sort of "Iowa style," just a collection of NIL-lured one-offs while the homegrown guys look over their shoulder, wondering if they're next. That doesn't mean they're all wrong. Keeping Lee around was a good move, and Bassett is a great get -- after huge effort. They're ahead of the curve on women's wrestling too, which over time will pay dividends on the men's side. But their problems run too deep to ignore. They're good, but make no mistake: they are neither strong nor thriving, just propped up by money. Take away their Nichols-bought mercenaries, and they're mid-tier, behind Illinois. So what to do? --The Brands brothers are fine but duplicative. Either cut one loose or put Terry in charge of the HWC full-time. --Clean house among the assistant coaches. --Go on a Portal diet: tell Nichols and your other donors you want to use the $ spent on future Parcos, Buchanans and Teemers to fund your infrastructure, namely coaches and HWC. --As for coaching, use those dollars to hire some of the best assistants in the country. Let them coach, don't get in their way, and hold them accountable. Cut it out with hiring only Iowa grads: diversify. --Dump time and money and staff into the HWC. Fill it out with a couple top coaches, and make it a go-to destination. The guys on your RTC roster are de facto coaches and your best practice partners. Coaches like DT get this, which is why OSU is passing Iowa at warp speed. --For heaven's sake, stop running your own recruits out of town. Show them some loyalty, and make it clear you expect loyalty back from them. --Rebuild your identity. Do things that make Iowa distinctive, whether in moves or style or the type of recruits you go after. Bassett can help show the way. When wrestlers feel a part of something, NIL offers are less apt to pull them away. --Getting young guys from the portal is fine, but with upperclassmen, the portal should be used only as a last resort to fill actual holes in the lineup, not to upgrade from an actual Iowa recruit. If your recruit hasn't performed up to snuff, the staff should take responsibility for failing to coach him up sufficiently. Starters should worry about losing their spot to a backup, not to some grad student from ASU or Oklahoma. Look, I don't like Iowa. At all. But I do respect them and want them to be strong, as that is better for the health of college wrestling, and it'd be nice if they could help funnel guys onto the US world team.

Meh. I can see why this wasn't called a slam. It started as a suplay but he sort of pivoted at the end. The ref and reply officials all saw it the same way. If they had just kept on wrestling, no one would be complaining about the non-call. I wouldn't have been shocked to see it called a slam after the replay, especially since his head appears to make contact first, but it isn't "absolutely inexcusable" to let it go either. Speaking of CP's histrionics, is it really necessary for him to complain that this is "incredibly dangerous," when this very same move is permitted in freestyle? And given that women's college wrestling follows freestyle rules, is it helpful or accurate to say that women's wrestling permits "incredibly dangerous" moves? Come on man. Bouzakis is incredibly powerful, but that's the source of the danger, not his moves.

I just watched it. Yeah, kinda embarrassing, but I can't get too upset about it. When they went back to video review, he was just arguing the case for his wrestler that it should've been a TD, not a slam. I agree it was a slam, but I don't think Ryan was out of line in arguing his wrestler's position to the refs while they reviewed the tape. That's pretty much his job description. Yes, saying it was "soft" and a "joke" might've taken it a bit too far, and it sure ticked off Goodale (rightly so). And Ryan carried on his tantrum for too long after the refs made their decision. But honestly, I was far more annoyed by Ryan's gutless decision to injury default Gallagher to Mesenbrink, and have Gallagher wrestle the backside. It takes some real chutzpah to do that while whining about Walsh, who MFF'd the next match.

My favorite part was where AJ Ferrari boasted about getting his “vanity” under control… while wearing an AJ Ferrari shirt.

I think it's cool. Ono didn't bring a coach and I'm glad PSU provided a couple of their best, who probably weren't getting paid. It's the decent thing to do, and it would've been seriously messed up if Ono was just there on his own, without a corner guy. Admittedly, Bo may have been in it more to beat the Iowa guy than to help Ono, but he and Zain did their jobs, and it's not like they were calling attention to themselves.

Random thoughts: Spencer looked huge compared to Ono, but Ono just too fast. He did give Ono his closest match of the past year though. Carr did a nice job but exhausted at the end. Japan's sportsmanship is 10/10. Bassett is annoyingly well-spoken and likable. Frustrating to not see Bryce pull the trigger. Gross is just a bad matchup for DeSanto, but I respect how much DeSanto has matured. Flo's videos leading up to the event were awesome, and it looks like they really filled the arena, which is great too. Thanks for doing this Flo.

Flo did a nice job tonight, and I agree their lead-in coverage was great too. Really appreciate the sportsmanship of the Japanese wrestlers, both at the event and in the Flo videos beforehand.

That's a complicated question, but at minimum I think coaches should be expected to communicate with broadcast networks beforehand. It was an embarrassing unforced error watching the B1G Network hype up the match, only to be like... "welp, guess we aren't seeing that one." If you're going to harm the product that you put out there for fans and viewers, at least do them the courtesy of a heads up so people can make other plans and so networks/announcers can be prepared.

It was hyped as the "match of the dual" on the B1G Network, in a dual meet which didn't exactly have a whole bunch of stellar matchups. Then the announcers had egg on their face when Ramos didn't go out there. Just a bad look all around.

This is where I am too, except for one thing: the fact that Spencer's wrestled this guy in practice before. I think he was getting the better of Ono, despite being in lousy shape. Do you really think Spencer would have agreed to bump up to face a defending world champ, in a main event, unless he had reason to think he'd come out on top? Do you think Brands would bless the match if he thought Spencer would lose, considering the funk Spencer seems to go into when he loses? That's really hard for me to believe. Not that Spencer's prone to ducking, but I can't think of any other occasion in high school, college or freestyle where he's bumped up or changed weights to seek out a top opponent. Why would he do it now? Especially given the confidence issues that have plagued him. So my theory is Spencer was beating Ono when they wrestled in Japan, and Spencer and coaches see this as a chance to boost his confidence going into this next cycle. Of course, even if I'm right, it may well be that Ono has gotten way better since then and/or wasn't giving 100% in practice. But that history, brief as it was, is the wild card that makes me think Ono isn't necessarily the favorite that he looks like on paper.

Can you imagine the atmosphere on the American bus ride as these guys head up to State College? The Bataan Death March on wheels.

Not buying that Alirez is ducking anyone. Remember this is a guy who entered the portal last year, and everyone was all up in arms about it and criticizing him for leaving a small program to chase after the bucks... and he ended staying. That's his reward, a bunch of guys saying he's ducking? When he's got NCAA and US Open titles under his belt? He may not run up the score much but the guy is a terror.

OK, now do THIS year, not two years ago, since the context is how Alirez should be seeded THIS year.

Although I think Alirez would probably beat Bartlett, and I slightly favor him over Mendez too, I think Beau should be the new #1. Both unbeaten and Beau has the stronger strength of schedule, and just beat #1. That's my rationale, but the real reason is the same as BruceyB's: I hate the fact that Bartlett and Mendez should have to face off in the semis for a third time just because Alirez never had to wrestle anyone in the top 10.