Dark Energy

Curious on the thinking … what difference are you referring to? Wrestling ability? And the middle / high school redshirt is ridiculous ^ 2. Sad whenever I hear it.

No, not exponentially more. But I do not know for certain. Many kids don’t redshirt. They do their four and are done. How do we feel about high schoolers purposefully take 5 years to finish high school so as to be more successful with their high school wrestling career? This is not all that different a situation. Sounds way more gross, I know. But why?

There isn’t a license but would need to be registered. Might need to pass a test. Background check. Not sure what rules are in your area. @Sheerstress has good advice. Generally start with youth tournaments and with JV tournaments. Once feel comfortable probably go with less critical duals and less critical tournaments. That said, with the ref shortage, perhaps get some good duals quickly!

Ha! Fair. Did sound arrogant.

Is the school saying — ‘hey, you didn’t get first chair, here is another year of scholarship for you? Feel free to extend your stay. Also, we will give less money to other band members since we are giving an extra year to you.’ I’ll answer - no, they are not. And what is this privilege crap? Most athletic scholarships are not full rides. With 5 year scholarships, let’s say kid is paying 50%. Now they have to pay it for 5 years with a redshirt. Not 4! If family is struggling to pay for college, 4 is the way. Going 5 is easier for those that have the money to pay!! Grayshirt - I’m not a fan. I don’t have a solution. I’d like to eliminate. Just don’t know how. Open to ideas. Can start a new thread if you like. Hell, some kids may need to work a year before going to college to help pay for it. Not privilege. Don’t want to penalize them.

Quoting my reply about grey shirts. Sounds pretty negative to me. But I see some here are not interested in honest debate and instead want to somehow besmirch me or have themselves having fun sounding like an arrogant schmuck. Privilege - hah. Glad to know your fighting stance. Ok - back to discussion. Let’s do the math. 9.9 athletic scholarships available. Will simplify from here but the point will be the same … assume all getting the scholarship money use for five years. That is 20 people and let’s round the limit to 10 to make math easier. So each is getting 0.5 scholarship. Over a simple 20 year period how many kids get this 1/2 ride? Easy, 4 increments of 5 years x 20 kids = 80. Let’s now say they all just get for 4 years. Now, the math is 5 increments of 4 years x 20 = 100 kids. Go ahead and get more precise, the outcome will be the same. More kids get more scholarships if the time frame is 4, not 5 years. Can do the math again another way and find that you could keep the number of kids at 80 and choose to INCREASE scholarships for the 4 year approach and spend the same amount of money. Or do a combo, mix of more kids getting scholarship and get more money. Nice. I totally get that redshirts make life easier for athletes and it makes it easier to win. I get it. I bet we can come up with many ideas to help with this. For example 1) require only 10 credit hours to be full time 2) give them automatic grade lifts in their classes 3) give full rides to all including stipends 4) don’t actually make them go to class 5) pay them as employees and allow 8 years of eligibility Crazy and absurd. Point is that limits need to be put in place somewhere. It is a question on where those limits are drawn. I’m someone that believes that the limits are not in the right place. I do not like the institutionalizing of incentives to take 5, not 4 years, to graduate. It wastes time, and takes REAL opportunity away from others.

Ok. So there is a TBar impersonator. TBar would never say anything negative about Cael’s management.

Thanks for posting the article. I was hopeful that is said something more than it makes it easier to win more (development), better for team winning more (team opportunity), and medical. It did, a bit. Still - I saw nothing that changes my mind that competing for four years I. College is not enough. Again, if Tuba player isn’t first seat, does she redshirt? If a bio major doesn’t get the research project she likes, does she redshirt? If the actor doesn’t get the lead in the play, does he redshirt? If the Chem E major doesn’t get the outcome she wants in a lab does she redshirt? Why is athletics so much more important that the system is contorting itself? If it was four years — and move on, would still be awesome. More kids getting more scholarships. More kids getting to top of podium and realizing the pinnacle of success in NCAA wrestling. More kids launching into successful careers earlier. Yes, paying for a kid to go to school for 5 or 6 years is better and easier for the one kid in that one window. And if it pays for a graduate degree, cool. But I expect that is the exception. And even still, it means another kid is not getting money for their undergrad degree. And this should be about undergrad kids.

Just because there is something that is worse doesn’t mean we should try to stop bad things that aren’t as bad. And just because something bad has happened for a long time, doesn’t make it good or that it is not worth trying to stop. Redshirts are a perversion. An excuse for a coach or school to try to have more champions / better team / whatever. If a kid isn’t ready to wrestle as a freshman, ok — try to start Sophomore year. Big freaking deal. Oh no, a maniacal sports fan is going to be upset. A fan that wants the kid to bend their life trajectory to the fan’s preferences. More money to fewer kids since the 9.9 needs to span 5 or 6 years instead of 4 per kid. It’s a bunch of adult’s shortening a kid’s career time span for the sake of the adults enjoying watching sports — and making money off the kids.

Harder to do. Gap years are a thing. If a kid / family wants to delay the start of their career, making money, etc … so that the dad can feel better about the kid’s college wrestling accolades, not much to be done. But the school and staff should not sanction it and even promote it. It’s all about twisting sport into something more important than it should be for a school.

Cornell commit Shapiro dominated through the Clarion open - 3 techs, MD and a fall in the final. Nice confidence builder. Sam Latona (VT) lays an egg to start the season.

The concept is stupid. Go to college, earn your degree - then play sports while there. Not good enough to start - oh well. Next year. Get hurt, that sucks. Move your life along. Eliminate redshirts. Do we redshirt Tuba players? Do we redshirt chemical engineers? Do we redshirt actresses? Do we redshirt pre-Med majors? Do we redshirt aspiring diplomats?

Seems like Mizzou and Minny have a reputation in my mind for flaming out at Nationals. Perhaps not every year but it seems to happen to them more than others. The impression that I have ….

Well, maybe next time. Glad to see Carr win. Wonder how much was Carr being better individually vs Wisconsin as a whole looking like like they aren’t ready.

You are very hard to understand. Hyper defensive it seems. Your inability to read the thread title or other posts on the thread is not on me. Thanks for the eventual answer though. I think I’m in that ball park too.

I’d say yes - not good. Latona seems to have lost something.

Looks like you didn’t read the original post in the thread. What odds would you need to bet against him winning an NCAA championship?

Huh? I could pretend to be right? Lost me. I think I asked a simple question. And it is out of curiosity. It is also the point of the thread. What odds would you need to bet against him?

Yea, I get it. How certain are you? What odds would you need to bet against him?

I think folks have gotten the message. Treatment has improved. But still, can be better. 99.5% of people are fine. Small minority need lessons in being constructive members of society. Sadly, I noticed it can get even worse with kids in grade school. Some parents were the worst form of humanity - even toward their own kids. Ugly. Rare. But still sad to see. That isn’t the main story. Overall people are appreciative and there is goodness. If you wilt easily — might be tough. But don’t need much of a backbone to do fine.

I had in my head that he was going to likely AA his first year. Not sure why. Clearly was wrong. Was he injured last year? Others surprised he didn’t do better?

Nickerson vs Long - Nickerson coming back from injury - puts a smack down on Long Burroughs vs Leen - loved Leen’s fire and effort. Burroughs - wow. Dake vs Taylor - all star and finals. Finals - Dake was so damn technical, smooth, and strong. Out smoothed and out technicaled a guy who I am still in awe of. Garrett vs Delgado - Delgado’s defense, dive roll - arghhh!! Snyder vs Gwiz - Epic!!! Nickal vs Martin (second finals) - Bo to his back!! Correcton!! Martin to HIS back!! Nickal vs Dean - great match. Sad finish.

Refs are needed. Many folks on this board seem to know a lot. They love the sport. They can contribute in a big way. Throw your hat in … be a ref. Sport needs you. The kids need you. Pay is not incredible but hey, you are getting paid. Will help you appreciate the sport even more.

I think there is a real and significant chance that his injury / surgery recovery will really hamper him. Sucks. Big time. I hope not. If no injury at this time, I probably need to win $1000 to bet $100. But it is there …. Thus my question.

Nice write up @nhs67 - I’m going with Foca from Cornell.