The real problem with RAF sustainabilty?

[BruceyB]

11 hours ago, 1032004 said:

there are tons of top tier guys not in college and we see most of the college guys enough anyway.

Tons? Look at the domestic rankings.. 

57kg: #3 Liam Cronin, #4 Daniel Deshazer, #7 Austin Assad, #8 Brady Roark

65kg: #1 Real Woods, #2 Joey McKenna.. no one else in the top 8

74kg: #3 Jerrett Jacques, #4 Quincy Monday, #6 Terrell Barraclough #7 Peyton Hall, #8 Ed Scott

79kg: #6 Ethan Riddle, #7 Kennedy Monday, #8 Muhamed McBryde

86kg: #7 Marcus Coleman, #8 Chris Moore

92kg: #5 Eric Schultz #6 Dustin Plott #7 Hayden Walters, #8 Patrick Brophy

97kg: #4 Ethan Laird, #5 Eric Schultz, #6 Zane Lanham, #7 Gavin Hoffman

125kg: #5 Jordan Wood, #6 Christian Lance, #7 Lucas Stoddard, #8 Alex Semenenko

How many of the guys I listed above are you really interested in watching compete? I'd say most weight classes are lucky if they have 5 interesting guys that are post-grad, and 5 guys per weight doesn't exactly scream longevity when it comes to interesting match-ups. Foreigners is the only long term solution. Make it an "US vs them" kind of event where every little kid and unknowing observer has a built in guy to root for, whether the know his backstory or not.

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

10 minutes ago, BruceyB said:

Tons? Look at the domestic rankings.. 

57kg: #3 Liam Cronin, #4 Daniel Deshazer, #7 Austin Assad, #8 Brady Roark

65kg: #1 Real Woods, #2 Joey McKenna.. no one else in the top 8

74kg: #3 Jerrett Jacques, #4 Quincy Monday, #6 Terrell Barraclough #7 Peyton Hall, #8 Ed Scott

79kg: #6 Ethan Riddle, #7 Kennedy Monday, #8 Muhamed McBryde

86kg: #7 Marcus Coleman, #8 Chris Moore

92kg: #5 Eric Schultz #6 Dustin Plott #7 Hayden Walters, #8 Patrick Brophy

97kg: #4 Ethan Laird, #5 Eric Schultz, #6 Zane Lanham, #7 Gavin Hoffman

125kg: #5 Jordan Wood, #6 Christian Lance, #7 Lucas Stoddard, #8 Alex Semenenko

How many of the guys I listed above are you really interested in watching compete? I'd say most weight classes are lucky if they have 5 interesting guys that are post-grad, and 5 guys per weight doesn't exactly scream longevity when it comes to interesting match-ups. Foreigners is the only long term solution. Make it an "US vs them" kind of event where every little kid and unknowing observer has a built in guy to root for, whether the know his backstory or not.

It feels like you're missing a lot of guys there.  #1,2,3 at heavy are out of college.  Who is #4?  

Plenty of others missing.

Or are you trying to compile a list of wrestlers you find boring?  I admit to being a bit confused.

Edited 17 hours ago by Interviewed_at_Weehawken

[boconnell]

4 hours ago, BruceyB said:

I was incorrect overall. Especially in the upper weights (86kg+) that is very well dominated by post-grad wrestlers. And even at the lighter weights, I shouldn't have said "majority." But from 57kg-79kg in flo's domestic rankings, 47% of the top 5 in those weights are still in college. So if you consider essentially half of the talent pool in 6 different weight classes is still in college, it's not the majority but a large portion, and that's just according to the rankings, which doesn't even include college guys that would almost certainly be in the top 5 if they competed in the open division.

 

Almost half is significant for sure.   That means they have about 3 real guys per weight without college guys.  That's a couple of shows and then they're out of guys.  So they definitely need the college guys or a lot more international guys.

[Lucho]

The problem with the US hosting these tournaments is that its very difficult for Iranian and Russian guys to come and compete. It is also very unlikely that Iranian guys will come over because we already have our own league in place with top Russian guys also competing there as well. RAF will only be a good draw for maybe Japanese and Cuban guys everyone else will be competing in Russia (PWL) or Iran. 

[Gene Mills Fan]

25 minutes ago, Lucho said:

The problem with the US hosting these tournaments is that its very difficult for Iranian and Russian guys to come and compete. It is also very unlikely that Iranian guys will come over because we already have our own league in place with top Russian guys also competing there as well. RAF will only be a good draw for maybe Japanese and Cuban guys everyone else will be competing in Russia (PWL) or Iran. 

Maybe some of that is put aside if the prize money gets up there.  Plus the viewership if they are looking to be a global character in MMA

[Gus]

Flo's Domestic Freestyle Rankings

57kg→College or HS guys: #2,5,6,8 

1	Spencer Lee	Hawkeye WC	1
2	Luke Lilledahl	Nittany Lion WC	2
3	Liam Cronin	Nebraska RTC	3
4	Daniel Deshazer	Gopher WC	4
5	Nico Provo	Cardinal RTC	5
6	Brendan McCrone	Ohio RTC	6
7	Austin Assad	Seasons Freestyle Club	7
8	Brady Roark	Jackrabbit WC	8

 

 61kg→College or HS guys: #1,4

RANK	NAME	CLUB	PREVIOUS
1	Jax Forrest	Bishop McCort HS	2
2	Vito Arujau	Spartan Combat RTC	1
3	Seth Gross	MATPAC WC	3
4	Marcus Blaze	Perrysburg WC	4
5	Daton Fix	Cowboy RTC	5
6	Austin Desanto	Hawkeye WC	6
7	Micheal McGee	Atreus WC	7
8	Nahshon Garrett	Lehigh Valley WC	8

 

65kg→College or HS guys: #3,4,5,6,7,8

RANK	NAME	CLUB	PREVIOUS
1	Real Woods	Cliff Keen WC	1
2	Joey McKenna	Cowboy RTC	2
3	Jesse Mendez	Ohio RTC	3
4	Marcus Blaze	Perrysburg WC	4
5	Aden Valencia	California RTC	5
6	Brock Hardy	Nebraska RTC	6
7	Carter Young	Cowboy RTC	7
8	Bo Bassett	Bishop McCort HS	8

 

70kg→ College or HS guys: #1,5

RANK	NAME	CLUB	PREVIOUS
1	PJ Duke	KD Training Center	1
2	Yianni Diakomihalis	Spartan Combat RTC	2
3	Ian Parker	Cavalier WC	3
4	Bryce Andonian	SERTC	4
5	Caleb Henson	SERTC	5
6	James Green	Nebraska RTC	6
7	Ridge Lovett	Nebraska RTC	7
8	Will Lewan	Cliff Keen WC	8

 

74kg→ College or HS guys: #2,5

RANK	NAME	CLUB	PREVIOUS
1	David Carr	Cyclone RTC	1
2	Mitchell Mesenbrink	Nittany Lion WC	2
3	Jarrett Jacques	Tiger Style WC	3
4	Quincy Monday	New Jersey RTC	4
5	Joey Blaze	Boilermaker RTC	5
6	Terrell Barraclough	Brunson UVRTC	6
7	Peyton Hall	West Virginia RTC	7
8	Ed Scott	Wolfpack WC	8

 

79kg→ College or HS guys: #1,3,4,5,6

RANK	NAME	CLUB	PREVIOUS
1	Levi Haines	Nittany Lion WC	1
2	Evan Wick	Askren Wrestling Academy RTC	2
3	Dean Hamiti Jr	Cowboy RTC	3
4	Simon Ruiz	Spartan Combat RTC	4
5	Carson Kharchla	Ohio RTC	5
6	Ethan Riddle	Minnesota RTC	6
7	Kennedy Monday	New Jersey RTC	7
8	Muhamed McBryde	West Virginia RTC	8

 

86kg→ College or HS guys: #6,8

RANK	NAME	CLUB	PREVIOUS
1	Zahid Valencia	Cowboy RTC	1
2	Kyle Dake	Nittany Lion WC	2
3	Carter Starocci	Nittany Lion WC	3
4	Chance Marsteller	New Jersey RTC	4
5	Parker Keckeisen	Panther WC	5
6	Rocco Welsh	KD Training Center	6
7	Marcus Coleman	Cyclone RTC	7
8	Chris Moore	Illinois RTC	8

 

92kg→ College or HS guys: #2,3,7,8

RANK	NAME	CLUB	PREVIOUS
1	Trent Hidlay	Wolfpack RTC	1
2	Josh Barr	Nittany Lion WC	2
3	Aeoden Sinclair	Tiger Style WC	3
4	Mike Macchiavello	Lehigh Valley WC	4
5	Eric Schultz	Nebraska RTC	5
6	Dustin Plott	Cowboy RTC	6
7	Hayden Walters	Cliff Keen WC	7
8	Patrick Brophy	Charleston RTC	8

 

97kg→ College or HS guys: #8

RANK	NAME	CLUB	PREVIOUS
1	Kyle Snyder	Nittany Lion WC	1
2	Hayden Zillmer	Gopher WC	2
3	Jay Aiello	Pennsylvania RTC	3
4	Ethan Laird	DMV RTC	4
5	Eric Schultz	Nebraska RTC	5
6	Zane Lanham		6
7	Gavin Hoffman	Mat-Town WC	7
8	Justin Rademacher	Beaver Damn RTC	8

 

125kg→ College or HS guys: #7,8

RANK	NAME	CLUB	PREVIOUS
1	Wyatt Hendrickson	Cowboy RTC	1
2	Trent Hillger	Gopher WC	2
3	Demetrius Thomas	Bears RTC	3
4	Hayden Zillmer	Gopher WC	4
5	Jordan Wood	Lehigh Valley WC	5
6	Christian Lance	Nebraska WTC	6
7	Lucas Stoddard	West Point WC	7
8	Alex Semenenko	Brown RTC	8

 

P4P→ College or HS guys: #9,13,15,17,19,20

RANK	WEIGHT	NAME	CLUB	PREVIOUS
1	57 kg	Spencer Lee	Hawkeye WC	2
2	86 kg	Zahid Valencia	Cowboy RTC	3
3	86 kg	Kyle Dake	Nittany Lion WC	4
4	61 kg	Vito Arujau	Spartan Combat RTC	1
5	97 kg	Kyle Snyder	Nittany Lion WC	5
6	86 kg	Chance Marsteller	New Jersey RTC	6
7	74 kg	David Carr	Cyclone RTC	7
8	70 kg	Yianni Diakomihalis	Spartan Combat WC	8
9	74 kg	Mitchell Mesenbrink	Nittany Lion WC	9
10	92 kg	Trent Hidlay	Wolfpack WC	10
11	86 kg	Carter Starocci	Nittany Lion WC	11
12	65 kg	Real Woods	Cliff Keen WC	12
13	61 kg	Jax Forrest	Bishop McCort HS	17
14	65 kg	Joey McKenna	Cowboy RTC	13
15	65 kg	Jesse Mendez	Ohio RTC	14
16	125 kg	Wyatt Hendrickson	Cowboy RTC	15
17	70 kg	PJ Duke	KD Training Center	16
18	70 kg	James Green	Nebraska RTC	18
19	61 kg	Marcus Blaze	Perrysburg WC	19
20	79 kg	Levi Haines	Nittany Lion WC	20

 

Therefore approximately 38% of the top 8 domestic wrestlers are HS or college wrestlers and 30% of the top 20 pound for pound guys.