I want to like freestyle but...

[KennyEBHS]

...but the rules are too arcane.

For instance:

1. If the ultimate goal of any wrestling is to pin their opponent, then why have a rule set that discourages pinning? If you turn a person and try to pin them, but don't, you only get two points. If you let up and bring them to the mat again, you get two more points, but there is no reward for holding your opponent on his or her back for the entire period!

2. Why are there replays when there is a mat judge and a referee?

3. The explanation for being put on the clock I continue to not understand.

4. Takedowns require control in both freestyle and foldstyle. I understand why control is the key in folkstyle, but control plays no role in freestyle, except in this one instance. To me that is inconsistent.

5. Finally, I have been watching wrestling since HS in the mid-sixties and I must admit I still do totally understand freestyle wrestling. And I bet most of the fans watching the OTT don't either.

 

Edited April 20 by KennyEBHS

[JuanMogen]

Hey! Somebody scored points. Time to throw the brick and waste everybody’s time. 

[JuanMogen]

Could be four points red…could be 2 points blue. Who knows? Let’s take five minutes to see who dominated the other guy because it’s impossible to tell.

 

real domination 

[wrestle87]

1 hour ago, KennyEBHS said:

...but the rules are too arcane.

For instance:

1. If the ultimate goal of any wrestling is to pin their opponent, then why have a rule set that discourages pinning? If you turn a person and try to pin them, but don't, you only get two points. If you let up and bring them to the mat again, you get two more points, but there is no reward for holding your opponent on his or her back for the entire period!

2. Why are there replays when there is a mat judge and a referee?

3. The explanation for being put on the clock I continue to not understand.

4. Takedowns require control in both freestyle and foldstyle. I understand why control is the key in folkstyle, but control plays no role in freestyle, except in this one instance. To me that is inconsistent.

5. Finally, I have been watching wrestling since HS in the mid-sixties and I must admit I still do totally understand freestyle wrestling. And I bet most of the fans watching the OTT don't either.

 

Well, respectfully, if you have been watching wrestling since the mid-60's, you have either not been paying too much attention, or you were REALLY confused 15 years ago, whereas now you are only gently confused by the ruleset, because things used to be MUCH worse.

1.  The point of international wrestling isn't pinning, it's turning.  They have the pin on the books, but it is borderline outdated.  The pin could be removed from Freestyle and Greco and it wouldn't change anything.

2. The replay happens on a matside monitor that they record with matside cameras (I believe).  If you are in the arena you can see it, I have never seen a remote broadcast where they show you the actual footage they are reviewing.

3. The shot clock is a tiebreaker system they have implemented which exists to drive action and make it so that guys don't just hang out and wait to score in the last 30 seconds.  It is close to stalling, with the added nuances of understanding that basically, the ref has to choose someone to hit first, and if things continue, the second guy will get put on the clock.  With the last point scoring giving criteria, being put on the clock first is a good thing in a slow match.

4. Like exposure, takedowns are about achieving a position, not achieving definitive control.  I don't know all the positions by heart, but for instance, the high crotch crackdown is a takedown in freestyle within certain bounds, whereas in folkstyle it never is. 

5.  That might be a bit of an overestimation about most fans not understanding...but if you are looking to learn, this is a good place to ask specific questions.

[monkeybanana53]

1 hour ago, KennyEBHS said:

...but the rules are too arcane.

For instance:

1. If the ultimate goal of any wrestling is to pin their opponent, then why have a rule set that discourages pinning? If you turn a person and try to pin them, but don't, you only get two points. If you let up and bring them to the mat again, you get two more points, but there is no reward for holding your opponent on his or her back for the entire period!

2. Why are there replays when there is a mat judge and a referee?

3. The explanation for being put on the clock I continue to not understand.

4. Takedowns require control in both freestyle and foldstyle. I understand why control is the key in folkstyle, but control plays no role in freestyle, except in this one instance. To me that is inconsistent.

5. Finally, I have been watching wrestling since HS in the mid-sixties and I must admit I still do totally understand freestyle wrestling. And I bet most of the fans watching the OTT don't either.

 

The ultimate goal of wrestling is not pinning, it is to simply score more points than the opponent. I agree that back exposure should be worth more points though.

Passivity:

• does not attempt or execute any holds.
• is satisfied just to neutralize the opponent's efforts, blocking holds.
• gives the impression of not trying to initiate effective holds.
• intentionally "plays the edge," flees the mat, or pushes the opponent away to avoid wrestling.
• holds the opponent by one or both hands to prevent him or her from wrestling.
• repeatedly fakes head throws; slips off; falls to the mat; lies flat on his or her stomach; locks his or her legs around the opponent's leg.
• in Greco-Roman wrestling, engages in combat with head thrust forward in order to prevent "body-to-body" contact.

[Tom formerly Tofurky]

It won't happen in what's left of my life, but I hope that the U.S. can move the sport to Free and Greco. Imagine how much more depth would be created, how much more competitive and how much larger WTT/OTT brackets would be as a result.

Wanna see weight classes added back to the Olympic Games? Go Free and GR in the U.S. (instead of collegiate) and watch more nations become competitive on the World stage as many of those young folks wrestle for other countries. More eyes on the sport means more viewers means more money means greater leverage power for UWW. 

[Caveira]

Bo don’t know lol 

https://www.facebook.com/share/r/NbBFmRJ64cg7jGq9/?mibextid=tmsC9e

[Tom formerly Tofurky]

33 minutes ago, Caveira said:

Bo don’t know lol 

https://www.facebook.com/share/r/NbBFmRJ64cg7jGq9/?mibextid=tmsC9e

How's Bo's international career shaping up?

[Caveira]

5 minutes ago, Tom formerly Tofurky said:

How's Bo's international career shaping up?

Pretty good.  Why?   He apparently can win fights against chimpanzees too.   
 

hint…. I’m not a super fan of freestyle fwiw.   That’s my sarcasm.