GrandOlm

If Sad ends up not going, I think you'd have to go back to the late 1930s (Johannes Kotkas) to find great wrestlers whose careers were derailed by politics to an even greater extent.

How many fans of international wrestling are there? As in, people who actually know non American wrestlers by name, their present form, and their accomplishments. A few thousand at best? Maybe much less. Sadulaev has a little microcelebirty status and name id, but other than him? My impression is that the biggest bloc of "international wrestling fans" (that aren't family members or former competitors) are hard core college wrestling fans who keep following these D1ers after they graduate. They know about domestic results and relive college matches through the domestic senior level season and intra American matchups. To them every foreign wrestlers is just some no name with a nationality based descriptor. Only Americans' performances matter (this American wrestled well, that other American did bad, this American would have done better). Nolf on today's FRL, I think is illustrative of some of these attitudes. Despite being a former senior level wrestler one year removed from competing, he had no clue Akgul retired, didn't know Geno was not retired, and had no insights to give about the 125kg field. He used the standard template rinse and repeat of "X American rep at Y weight is super good, he's my pick to win gold" that most wrestlers who don't follow wrestling use when they get asked questions by the wrestling media. Sort of a non sequitur, but if the competitors don't even care to learn about foreign wrestlers why should the fans? It does feel strange.

Not a single Bulgarian medalist at u20s, the hosts. And commentators were annoyed that the Bulgarian wrestling federation was making so much noice and threats (which turned out to be empty anyways).

Well when you have a system that funnels people who aren't the pinnacle of the main track into something, what to expect? Add to them being usually well undertrained in the style compared to their competitors. Greco is far from optimized by the rest of the world, but other countries have figured out that at least by 15 you get them training full time. Other countries who are good at multiples styles often geographically separate them. It helps ameliorate the "jack of all trades master of none" and "Team A style Team B style" problems.

It's interesting to me how much volatility there has been in Greco Roman wrestling. If this tournament had existed in the 1920-40s, there would have been a lot of Swedish, Finnish, and German medalists. From the 50-80s Bulgaria, Romania, and Poland would have medaled a lot. Now these countries are either completely irrelevant or third rate at best. Iran and Azerbaijan have slotted in as the new stand outs.

Wrestling is just not popular anywhere in the world, with a few notable exceptions (Iran). And even where it does have some foothold, it's usually an inward facing participant only sport. It also doesn't help that many events are hosted in countries with low interest, low participation, and poor results.

Because high schools have folk style and not freestyle teams. It's that simple I don't agree with that line of thinking. Short distance races, wrestling, chariot racing, jousting, horse racing, baseball, have at certain points in history been the most popular and culturally needle moving sports in various civilizations. A lot of sports on that list are now either gone or niche. We happen to live in a time when team based ball sports are most popular.

I think these wrestlers are primarily getting developed at youth clubs. But yeah, a lot of world level wrestlers in the US are opening these clubs/academies and living off them as small business owners. And they get these kids young often, like 5 years old young.

I kind of figured. The Flo guys kept on making pilot jokes. That is a boring 9-5 life.

They are in their very late 20s/early 30s. I think your early 30s are still prime, especially at this heavy of a weight class. I think mid 30s can still be prime for 125/130 kg.

I think the only reason Freestyle got included in the Olympics originally was to appeal to Americans. It just happened so long ago that the styles slightly diverged again. Like before WW2, the European wrestlers were all greco roman style and they'd double enter the Freestyle events (kind of like Fargo wrestlers do). These double entrants ended up medaling a lot because the US wasn't sending committed people and there weren't specialists around to stop them. That wikipedia page lists folk styles from England, Ireland, and Italy..... Those wrestling traditions are long dead. They might be getting the HEMA treatment by a couple "eccentrics" but these are not competitive sports.

He's probably still getting over losing at the olympics. Silver and bronze back to back is brutal. He should have one more chance, but after that it's too late.

I think the Neal example is turning into the Neal exception. The NFL is not a skill sport, so it does have this small window for a couple of special individuals. But there are still specific and rare physical attributes that you need to succeed, and just being world medalist level heavyweight wrestler isn't nearly enough. I also think that some of these wrestlers are realizing that the non sports world of jobs isn't all that exciting or glamourous. I'm curious how Wyatt will pan out. Military pilot (or daresay even fighter pilot) might be one of the few non entertainment careers that can compete with freestyle wrestler.

I agree with you overall. But Masoumi has to make a decision for the here and now. I think he chose AZE since they're the top mercenary team. So the money and just the set up that they have ready for wrestlers is the best. I didn't buy that he was going to Armenia. AZE are actually smart how they focus on Greco for the natives (the easier style to get good at as a nation) and leave the other style for foreigners. It's like a win win for them. Not to derail the thread, it is interesting how a Shia nation is on bad terms with one of the few majority Shia (albeit secular) countries.

It may or may not work out, but how is it an awful idea for sure? Igor Rosotorotsky was the second best wrestler on the planet when he was a young man. He should have been at minimum a 2 or 3 time Olympic medalist with many World and European medals. But because of wrestling's unfair ways of selecting athletes to compete and the lack of transferring in his era, he was denied a full career (retired at 26). Now he's just a foot note, a trivia question about someone else's career. I wish transferring was a thing back in the 80s and 90s. I think Igor would have been part of many special moments. Other sports don't do this. They let people compete from more than one country if they're that good. Why do wrestlers have to sacrifice themselves for seemingly these arbitrarily designed processes (when there is an obvious out). You're only young once and time goes quickly. If you want to have a wrestling career and you can go somewhere where you can qualify, what's the downside exactly? Unless Masoumi is angling to be a politician in Iran after he retires? But you still need to have a good career even for that to happen. Well Ali Arslan is not a 2 meter tall super heavyweight, I don't know why he transfered. Masoumi can't chop his leg off and make 97 to help Iran. So he's either not on the team or he beats Zare (or whoever else comes up). Either way, a really good wrestler is not contributing (besides other countries not having them). It's not just about beating Zare. There's more to wrestling than beating one opponent. What if Zare is just a bad match up for him? What if someone else can beats Zare for him in a tournament? Masoumi can never beat Zare again and win an Olympic, it's not that far fetched. Plus he can win silver and bronze medals at all the biggest tournaments even if Zare stops him every time. He has the option of trying to beat Zare or aging him out. But Zare is only 24. Are you going to wait 10 years for a guy you're only 3 years the junior of. And you won't be getting that time back. Personally, I'd just be proud that my nation produced a great athlete like that. I'd be mad at the dumb rules that forced his hand to transfer and cheer for them anyways.